Submitting entire project manual elec...

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Author Message Anne Whitacre, CCS CSI Senior Member Username: awhitacre Post Number: 250 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Monday, September 26, 2005 - 04:56 pm:    I searched through earlier threads but did not find the discussion I need now. Has anyone submitted their entire project manual to the repro house electronically? We have one project where we've been getting the consultant specs as pdfs, and then converting our specs to pdfs, and then sending the entire package electronically to the print shop. We've been doing this with drawings for years, but have typically still turned in hard copy specs. I have to admit that doing the entire manual electronically is making me nervous, but I also admit that compiling 5000 page documents is no fun either, and is pretty darn heavy. So... any pitfalls that you know of, or can see with electronic submission of the entire project manual? What has your experience been? Marc C Chavez Senior Member Username: mchavez Post Number: 135 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Monday, September 26, 2005 - 05:10 pm:    I've sent one out. UW's new research center. It worked fine except that since I published each section individually and then sent them to the printer and to the project FTP site, they can be read separately. It is nice to note that the Contractor, MA Mortenson would like the spec as a single pdf with bookmarks. I like that idea too. Nathan Woods, CCCA Senior Member Username: nwoods Post Number: 23 Registered: 08-2005 Posted on Monday, September 26, 2005 - 05:11 pm:    I have a major construction project underway in Irvine California ($400 million in hard costs), and we are using all digital delivery via Planwell. I really like it, because updates are easily and inexpensively distributed. It takes the spec writer slightly more time to "print" each document to PDF, because the files need to be individually named, but it saves time everywhere else. The key has been keeping file sizes manageable. I have received a 96mb file that was one scanned spec manual as a single static PDF. That was awful, and very hard to navigate and use. Since then, we have insisted on using individually "printed" files by section, from Word directly into PDF, and that makes the files into a much more efficient vector format, and far easier to navigate. If you are sophisticated in your production the manuals, they can be written with a "live" TOC and navigatable bookmarks for every section, but that is not as straightforward to produce. It will become the industry standard before long however. I recommend honing those skills now. Nathan Woods, CCCA Senior Member Username: nwoods Post Number: 24 Registered: 08-2005 Posted on Monday, September 26, 2005 - 05:13 pm:    LOL, Marc responded seconds before I did, but I fully agree. Best case is one PDF with navigatable bookmarked sections. That is what I was trying say with twice as many words in my last paragraph :-) George A. Everding, AIA, CSI, CCS, CCCA Senior Member Username: geverding Post Number: 71 Registered: 11-2004 Posted on Monday, September 26, 2005 - 05:33 pm:    Previously, we would submit electronically in MS Word, but there were often glitches caused by differences in software defaults at the printer and at our offices. With our usual printer, we could trust that the formats would work ok, but it was always iffy with a new printer. PDFs seem to have solved that formatting problem. So far, we too have done individual pdf's for each section, but the bookmarked single pdf does hold promise as "best case", I agree. Wayne Yancey Senior Member Username: wyancey Post Number: 74 Registered: 05-2005 Posted on Monday, September 26, 2005 - 05:34 pm:    Mark, Do you know how to go from individual spec sections (doc or pdf) to a master document with bookmarks (pdf)? Does this process (or prawcess) require additional Adobe software? Thanks, Wayne Margaret G. Chewning FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: presbspec Post Number: 67 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Monday, September 26, 2005 - 05:49 pm:    I typically send my spec sections to my clients in PDF format to send off to the printer. I set up my file names so that the files are in the folder in the in the order they should appear in the Project manual. The only glitch I have run into was when something had to be inserted manually or when it was the first time the printer had received specs that way. I've just gotten the Adobe Acrobat Pro and have not used this application yet, but the product information has an application where I can print my Word files to PDF into a single file for the printer to use to print out the job. Will let you know if it works after I use it. Mark Gilligan SE, CSI Senior Member Username: markgilligan Post Number: 35 Registered: 05-2005 Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 12:43 am:    As a consultant (Structural) one of the results of electronic distribution is that more and more often the printing cost has been shifted to us. It is not just the paper and supplies but the time and disruption involved in printing hard copies. There is still a lot to be said for hard copies distributed by the lead design professional. The secret is to find the right balance in the way we use technology. David Oglesby, CSI, CCS, CCCA, SCIP New member Username: wdeo_specs Post Number: 1 Registered: 03-2005 Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 03:51 pm:    I have worked on a number of projects where all consultants sent (or uploaded to FTP site) PDF's for printing at a common reprographics firm. One problem I have noticed is not all the consultants use the same file naming convention. Ditto for drawing file naming. Using filenames that a computer arranges in the propoer order is key. One architect I work with had to spend a day & a half at the printers getting things in the right sequence so they could run the job. For specs I suggest the following file naming convention - 00000_ABC-00.doc where 00000 is the masterformat section number (this forces everyone to use the same MF version), _ABC can identify the consultant firm's initials to identify author if needed, -00 can identify various issues or Bid Packages. If job numbers are desired, they can occur before or after the section number (I prefer after). A date can be used (later in the file name) but I suggest 2005-09-27 so even these order themselves in proper sequence. I follow UDS recommendations for drawing filenames. Margaret G. Chewning FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: presbspec Post Number: 68 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 05:33 pm:    I just had a meeting with a client this afternoon to negotiate a project. One of our sticking points is: he wants the job delivered electronicly in Word so last minute corrections can be made, not PDF as I normally do. When I explained my reasons for hesitating to agree to this, (copyright, reuse issues) he said he understood and suggested I include in our agreement a specific "no-reuse" clause. Has anyone else had experience with this? I do put a "tag" in the binding margin. Is there a way to protect that without affecting the rest of the document? This is a client I want to keep, so walking away isn't an option. Nathan Woods, CCCA Senior Member Username: nwoods Post Number: 25 Registered: 08-2005 Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 05:36 pm:    Margaret, is your client telling you he is going to modify your spec without involving you? There is no good reason that I can think of where you cannot be available at the last minute and simply email him the changes via PDF. Do you not also have a need to maintain the most current version of the specification on YOUR files? Margaret G. Chewning FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: presbspec Post Number: 69 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 05:50 pm:    He stated he would agree to alert me should a modification be needed and send me a corrected copy. I agree with you Nathan, this makes me a bit nervous, although I feel fairly secure that they would not reuse/abuse the specs. They may be concerned about my being a one person shop. Altho' I'm usually reachable, how critical can something be prior to printing. Sheldon Wolfe Senior Member Username: sheldon_wolfe Post Number: 161 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 - 12:01 am:    If you're e-mailing the documents, last minute changes should not be an issue. You can make changes on your end and e-mail a new pdf in about the same time as making the same changes on the other end. I'd say send pdfs, and be on hand to make any last minute changes and e-mail new pdfs as needed. David J. Wyatt Senior Member Username: david_j_wyatt_csi_ccs_ccca Post Number: 10 Registered: 07-2005 Posted on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 - 08:59 am:    Margaret's thoughts are high on the list of concerns of many independent consultants. Our resources are mainly intellectual ones that can be mis-used by ill-intentioned people no matter how we try to protect them. Whereas it is true that pdf files are more difficult to use for other projects, the information can be extracted. Client-consultant relationships thrive on trust from both sides. It's hard to maintain trust when the air reeks with suspicion. Margaret G. Chewning FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: presbspec Post Number: 70 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 - 09:26 am:    Thanks for your thoughts. I've got a call in to the client now to get him to accept PDF's. Have any of you dealt with a similar situation, and have some recommended arguments I could use? BTW earlier I said I would report on that compiling function in the Adobe Acrobat. I used it last night to send off a project to another client. Worked great! Made a huge file, but it could still be emailed after compressing it with WinZip. Just make sure none of the files are protected. Margaret Robert E. Woodburn Senior Member Username: bwoodburn Post Number: 79 Registered: 01-2005 Posted on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 - 10:04 am:    Is that the Acrobat function that combines separate files (even of different types, I believe) into one big pdf? If so, does it let you insert the bookmarks referred to earlier, or is that a separate proceess? Thanks. Tracy Van Niel Senior Member Username: tracy_van_niel Post Number: 138 Registered: 04-2002 Posted on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 - 10:17 am:    I have a question though about printing .pdf files from a zip file ... whenever we have had to do it because a consultant has not given us hard copy ... If I try to do a "batch" print (by selecting a quantity of sections and then sending them to print at one time), it does not print the sections in order. How can you batch print .pdfs from a zip file and have them print in order? Margaret G. Chewning FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: presbspec Post Number: 71 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 - 10:31 am:    yes it is the function to combine files into one PDF. Don't know about the book marks yet. Still learning the program. Regarding printing from the Zip file. I don't. I use the WinZip just to compress it so it can be E-mailed. The document I'm sending is already is in order for printing and I think should be extracted from the zipfile for use. David E Lorenzini Senior Member Username: deloren Post Number: 56 Registered: 04-2000 Posted on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 - 07:12 pm:    Tracy, I batch-print my PDF files from Windows Explorer. I found that they will print in the order they appear in the list, starting from the file under the cursor when you right click. The process I use is this: After I select the range of files I want to print, I right click to get the Shorthand Menu that contains the Print command. Wherever I place my cursor over the selected area is where the files will start printing. By placing it over the top most file (the beginning), all the files will print in order. I'm not sure if it works for everyone, but that is the way it works for me. Ron Beard CCS Senior Member Username: rm_beard_ccs Post Number: 78 Registered: 10-2002 Posted on Friday, September 30, 2005 - 12:34 am:    Margaret: <so last minute corrections can be made> The most likely reason there are last minute changes is that they are trying to insert something they “forgot” to tell you about in the first place. I wouldn’t let them touch your sections. <he would agree to alert me should a modification be needed and send me a corrected copy> It will take him more time and effort to do this than it would be to call you directly and have you make the modification. At least that way you know that the modification was made correctly, in the right location, and doesn’t conflict with another part of the project manual. <include in our agreement a specific "no-reuse" clause> It is my experience that such a clause is worthless, or rather, only as good and honest as the client. For nearly three decades I have used such a clause and it will not deter the “bad apple” for violating this mutually agreed upon contractual condition. I have been burned several times over the years. After three projects, they have a reasonably good number of sections to use as a basis for most projects. They know that it will be a cold day in H*** before I pursue the issue. In fact, I almost always use a copyright symbol on every page I prepare [the exceptions are most Federal or state projects that will not permit any individual copyrights] just as a reminder. The copyright symbol nor the "no-reuse" clause are not going to stop someone determined to use your work. I regularly use CSI’s greatest resource - the industry member. When you work with a rep to correct and update a spec section and you see him/her months later and they say: “Hey, I thought we upgraded our section?” And I say “What project?” and it turns out to be this client who is now using your spex, you know exactly what has happened. If a client has any respect for you, they will understand and honor your protectiveness of your work. The ones that push otherwise are just trying to use you. They will take whatever they can get and run their own direction. I have many good and respectful clients. They are the clients that make this business enjoyable and don’t give you headaches. The only real "compensation" is that you sadly feel "honored" that they like your work well enough to use it on their own. <This is a client I want to keep, so walking away isn't an option.> I beg to differ. Personal integrity and the value you place on your work are more important, in the long run, than any single client. Respectfully, Ron Ron Beard CCS Senior Member Username: rm_beard_ccs Post Number: 79 Registered: 10-2002 Posted on Friday, September 30, 2005 - 03:51 am:    When providing pdf's to clients, what security requirements, or restrictions (like printing only), do ya'al use? Ron Margaret G. Chewning FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: presbspec Post Number: 72 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Friday, September 30, 2005 - 06:51 am:    Thank you Ron for your sage advice. Fortunately, I spoke with the principal of the firm, explained my position and he had no problem with it, and we now have a contract using pdf deliverables. Not sure where the Word Doc requirement came from, suspect it was from an Admin type. Hopefully this will help the rest of you if (when) you come against a similar issue. Thanks for the help. Margaret Tomas Mejia, CCS, CCCA, LEED Senior Member Username: tmejia Post Number: 23 Registered: 09-2003 Posted on Friday, September 30, 2005 - 11:41 am:    Adobe is giving 1/2 day seminars on Acrobat 7.0 in October. The cities are New York, Anaheim, San Francisco, Boston, Toronto and Chicago. Here is the URL address http://www.acrobat7ontour.com/index.asp?site=1218m2&sourcecode=1218m2 I'm headed to Anaheim on Oct. 11. Tommy (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Sunday, October 09, 2005 - 12:54 pm:    We have delivered a few project manuals in PDF format (with no paper copy). We have a few restrictions, however: 1-Must be PDF files, locked from copying the text (print and view only). 2-All documents must be printed on paper and checked in-house before generating the PDF files; we always find mistakes in the printed copy that were not noticed on screen. Also note that we usually "string" the files to gether into ONE pdf file of the whole project manual. This allows the architect to hit "print" once and get everything to print out in correct order. Note - there is cheap, easy, reliable software available to do this (not by Adobe) for under $100. Ron Beard CCS Senior Member Username: rm_beard_ccs Post Number: 81 Registered: 10-2002 Posted on Monday, October 10, 2005 - 12:21 pm:    Unregistered Guest: <Note - there is cheap, easy, reliable software available to do this (not by Adobe) for under $100.> What software do you recommend? Ron Doug Brinley AIA CSI CDT CCS Senior Member Username: dbrinley Post Number: 129 Registered: 12-2002 Posted on Monday, October 10, 2005 - 12:28 pm:    I'm not 'unregistered guest' but our office uses 'win2pdf'. I'm not entirely sure what win2pdf does except we use it to 'print' pdf files to a folder. Leon Ruch, RA, CSI, CCS (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Monday, October 10, 2005 - 12:24 pm:    I found a shortcut the other day for combining PDFs into a single file (Acrobat 5.0; presumably also works for 6.0 and 7.0). Open the first PDF, then highlight the files to be added in Windows Explorer, and drag-and-drop them into the end of the first PDF. Similar to what David Lorenzini points out above, the position of the cursor when starting the drag-and-drop operation appears to affect the order in which they are added. Doug Brinley AIA CSI CDT CCS Senior Member Username: dbrinley Post Number: 130 Registered: 12-2002 Posted on Monday, October 10, 2005 - 01:25 pm:    I use Leon's method. You can also change the order the files are positioned by dragging and dropping. Use the left 'document organizer' window in Acrobat. John Carter New member Username: johnatcplusc Post Number: 1 Registered: 10-2005 Posted on Monday, October 10, 2005 - 03:58 pm:    The software that I mentioned (for stringing together PDF files into one large file) is Scansoft's PDF Converter. Retails for $99. It does far more that that one task, but it does it much better than Adobe (in my opinion). Tom Peck Senior Member Username: tom_peck_csi Post Number: 23 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Tuesday, October 11, 2005 - 11:20 am:    If you have Adobe 6.0 Professional, you can also create a single pdf from multiple pdf's ... File > Create pdf > From multiple pdf's. You can rearrange the individual pdf's to ensure they are in the correct order in the one combined pdf. Jerry Foshee Intermediate Member Username: jf05 Post Number: 4 Registered: 09-2005 Posted on Tuesday, October 11, 2005 - 11:47 am:    <You can rearrange the individual pdf's to ensure they are in the correct order in the one combined pdf.> An alternate way, or if you make a mistake with that method would be to use the following function: DOCUMENT(from the tool bar) / PAGES / INSERT or DOCUMENT / PAGES / EXTRACT The pages inserted must be in the form of a "whole" PDF file. (Not simply a few pages from a file.) Randall T. Bailey, PE, CSI, CCS, LEED AP Senior Member Username: baileyr Post Number: 9 Registered: 07-2005 Posted on Thursday, June 08, 2006 - 04:26 pm:    Question for those who have used Adobe 7.0 Professional to merge multiple section files and related documents into a single PDF file: I am repeatedly getting an error message as follows: An error occurred wile creating a temporary file: You cannot save a template file to non-template format..." This kills the merging process and I have to start over. The files are MS Word .doc format, in Word 2000. There is no apparent reason this should be happening. Can anyone offer an interpretation and solution for this error? Any thoughts or suggests would be most appreciated. Margaret G. Chewning FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: presbspec Post Number: 101 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Thursday, June 08, 2006 - 04:36 pm:    Not sure why you are getting the template error note, but I have found that I have to make sure that none of the documents I'm compiling are in active trackmode at the time I'm saving to a PDF binder. They can still show the changes if you want them, but the active function has to be off on each document or you'll get stuck and have to start again. It can be aggravating but I do find that it forces me to do a final check on all of my sections before setting them up for delivery. J. Peter Jordan Senior Member Username: jpjordan Post Number: 189 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Thursday, June 08, 2006 - 05:17 pm:    It is quite easy, in my experience, to save a document as a template without thinking. This is particularly true for people whose grasp of word processing is limited to "automated typing." You might want to pull up the folder window. You should be able to see a slightly different icon for the template files or sort accorting to file type. You can also turn on the file extensions, and the .dot (the template extention) will become apparent. I have had instances where I had been working on files generated by someone other than myself and not under my direction and between 5 and 10 percent of the files had been generated as template files. Karen Kaffel New member Username: kakaffel Post Number: 1 Registered: 05-2006 Posted on Friday, June 09, 2006 - 10:31 am:    Randall, Actually you have to take any documents that have a DOT extension (example 02300.DOT) and open those documents in Word 2000 and save them with a DOC extension (when you go and save the file, under "Save as Type" select "WORD DOCUMENT"...example you'll see after you save that document to look as 02300.DOC). Randall T. Bailey, PE, CSI, CCS, LEED AP Senior Member Username: baileyr Post Number: 10 Registered: 07-2005 Posted on Friday, June 09, 2006 - 03:47 pm:    Margret/Peter/Karen: Thanks for the responses and suggestions. Unfortunately, all files are .PDF or .DOC (no template files), so that's not the problem. And, Track Changes is not turned on in any of the files. This is a new problem since we upgraded to Adobe Professional version 7.0; didn't have this problem in 6.0. Another unfortunate example of going backwards by moving forward. I will share the solution if I am able to solve the problem. Anonymous   Posted on Friday, June 09, 2006 - 01:43 pm:    I have released an entire set of DSA approved CD's for a catigory 1 building (science center for a community college in calif.)in one bookmarked pdf file authored by acrobat pro (v?) a couple of years ago. The disk was about 200 megs. Portions of the drawings and specs had 'buttons'to quickly bring up the appropriate details or related sections. Probably took all of three days for an intern to do this authoring - pretty simple. The IOR had this availible for his work. Used a laptop. No more field set. The record set was done this way as well. So far so good. I am looking fwd to file an entire project alpha omega - paperless. Very green. No more flat files or telephone book sized project manuals...I am surprised at this thread. I thought everybody did this. Sheesh. John McAnulty RA