| Author |
Message |
ken hercenberg
Senior Member
Username: khercenberg
Post Number: 1361
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Friday, April 23, 2021 - 12:02 pm: |    |
Curious to see if anyone else is using PPD as a Contract Document in lieu of the traditional Specification Book/Project Manual. I've used this for GMP packages in the past and may be considering it for a negotiated bid project with a known set of Contractors and Installers.
How involved does your content get? Do you include detailed information that is typically included in Parts 1 and 3 of your traditional spec Section or is it typically more of a description of assemblies, perhaps BOD plus Alternates, plus a list of BOD products?
Have you ever used PPD for "technical" content and then issued a Division 00 and 01 package as the front end? |
Deborah Corr (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Monday, April 26, 2021 - 05:30 pm: | |
Oooh - I like this question! And I'm sad there are no responses yet. I would love to see a PPD used as a PPD (haven't gotten anyone to do it yet). I like the idea of a PPD as substituting for the technical sections on some projects. Wonder if anyone will bite on that idea. |
(Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Monday, April 26, 2021 - 10:51 pm: | |
I worked on the spec for the design-build competition for the Harold Washington library in Chicago in the late 1980's.
It was more detailed than a typical PPD, but it was presented in UniFormat.
The competing firms submitted drawings, models and MasterFormat specifications.
The winning firm was graded 4th of 5 entries on the specifications, but won because they pitched the image of an open book.
A comprehensive PPD can be used as a contract for design build if all the players are on board. |
Louis Medcalf, FCSI, CCS
Senior Member
Username: louis_medcalf
Post Number: 117
Registered: 11-2010
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 27, 2021 - 04:18 pm: | |
I specified a couple of resort hotels some years ago that had structures in a large atrium supposed to look like aged historic buildings. I supplemented the MasterFormat specs with UniFormat descriptions for the specialty contractor rather than trying to specify peeling paint and moss growth. |
Marc Chavez
Senior Member
Username: mchavez
Post Number: 624
Registered: 07-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 27, 2021 - 07:30 pm: | |
well for the chicago library you have to admit they did build it with an open book on the top. |
James Sandoz, AIA, CSI, CCS
Senior Member
Username: jsandoz
Post Number: 323
Registered: 06-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 28, 2021 - 09:08 am: | |
I believe Uniformat is very useful for early pricing, if not for construction documents, and I think many contractors agree. The trouble is, those who don't understand 3-part specifications, and they are legion, REALLY don't understand Uniformat. I think the letters and numbers confuse them.
The concept of specifications (MasterFormat and Uniformat) describing work results has been in play for some time now but still seems to elude many. |
Louis Medcalf, FCSI, CCS
Senior Member
Username: louis_medcalf
Post Number: 118
Registered: 11-2010
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 28, 2021 - 11:49 am: | |
I think the 1995 MasterFormat was the last version that had provisions in the user guide for combining UniFormat information in project manuals. |
ken hercenberg
Senior Member
Username: khercenberg
Post Number: 1368
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 28, 2021 - 12:36 pm: | |
I think you're right Louis.
I would, and have, personally advocate adding "Systems and Assemblies" back into Division 00 as a non-contract document.
Off topic, when I worked with Bob Johnson we had developed a System and Assemblies Drawing format to use 20-odd years ago with our PPD, corresponding to each system specified. We tried to get buy-in from the Architects we worked with to use it as a 'front end' document in the CDs, essentially a Drawing and Spec TOC on steroids, with corresponding MasterFormat keynotes to create an holistic trail of breadcrumbs to make finding content easier. Everyone loved the idea; no one was willing to budget it into their projects to make it a reality.
Go figure. |
Dan Helphrey
Senior Member
Username: dbhelphrey
Post Number: 73
Registered: 12-2018
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 28, 2021 - 02:44 pm: | |
I generally think of the 01 80 00 series as where I would put UniFormat information if I were integrating into a MasterFormat spec. |
ken hercenberg
Senior Member
Username: khercenberg
Post Number: 1369
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 28, 2021 - 03:04 pm: | |
Thanks Dan.
That would certainly make it a Contract Document! |
Ed Storer
Senior Member
Username: ed_storer
Post Number: 89
Registered: 05-2009
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 28, 2021 - 03:16 pm: | |
I was accidentally the "anonymous" poster about the Harold Washington Library. I got involved in writing the post and skipped the Username, etc.
We were charged with writing a performance spec. Uniformat was the obvious choice as we were writing for system performance without actually specifying products.
It went well beyond the usual "slapped together" PPD.
Ed Storer, CSI Member Emeritus |
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