Problems with paint adhesion on doors

Log Out | Topics | Search Moderators | Register | Edit Profile

Author Message David G. Axt, CCS, CSI ,SCIP Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 1855 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Tuesday, March 09, 2021 - 04:57 pm:    Has anyone had problems with paint peeling off newly painted steel doors? This problem has cropped up recently even though I have specified MPI INT 5.1S system for decades. The primer is the standard door manufacturer's primer with spot prime of MPI #107 Rust-Inhibitive Water-Based Primer and MPI #147 Latex, Interior, Institutional Low Odor/VOC Semi-Gloss top coats. David G. Axt, CCS, CSI, SCIP Specifications Consultant Axt Consulting LLC Ed Storer Senior Member Username: ed_storer Post Number: 74 Registered: 05-2009 Posted on Wednesday, March 10, 2021 - 06:11 pm:    I haven't, but I never used MPI as a spec. Generally, I've found that for interior doors, the manufacturer's standard primer was OK with a good quality semi-gloss acrylic. Exterior doors are a different beast. I stopped specifying galvanized steel for the faces. I specified galvanealed steel, with no factory primer. Primer-field applied acrylic or epoxy with acrylic or urethane topcoats. Ed Storer, CSI Member Emeritus Guest (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Wednesday, March 10, 2021 - 10:21 pm:    It comes up every now and then. Usual culprit is poor preparation or not priming with a compatible primer for the specified topcoat. David, is the paint peeling off the primer, or the primer peeling off the metal substrate? In my experience it is usually the former and the door manufacturers can make sure the shop-applied primer adheres to the substrate properly. If I recall, you can find in most HM door manufacturers' literature some fine print saying the shop-applied primer is meant to prevent rusting, and that water-based paints are typically not compatible with the shop primer. You usually need to prep and prime the already primed door, or use an oil-based topcoat (not usually acceptable with VOC requirements on most of my projects). David G. Axt, CCS, CSI ,SCIP Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 1856 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Thursday, March 11, 2021 - 11:55 am:    I think I have identified the problem. The painter painted the finish coats over the manufacturer's shop primer instead of priming the doors with the primer that I specified. The subcontractor skipped a step and now wants money to correct their screw up. I have modified the language in my specification to reinforce that the contractor needs to apply primer over the shop primer. David G. Axt, CCS, CSI, SCIP Specifications Consultant Axt Consulting LLC Edward J Dueppen, RA, CSI, CCS, LEED AP Senior Member Username: edueppen Post Number: 73 Registered: 08-2013 Posted on Friday, March 12, 2021 - 08:35 am:    David - you asked a good question. I assumed the factory primer was adequate for application of field finishing, but I learned it is not (unless you are using oil-based paints). I checked with my Assa-Abloy rep. and this is the document he sent me: https://content.assaabloyusa.com/doc/AADSS1077972&.pdf Since we primarily use water-based paints I will need to add a statement to our painting specs requiring the use of primers over the factory primer. David G. Axt, CCS, CSI ,SCIP Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 1857 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Friday, March 12, 2021 - 11:38 am:    Edward, The Curries paint information in the link you provided was included in the steel door submittal. Those that reviewed the submittals (contractors or architects) seemed noticed it. I have altered my client's construction administration people as to this issue. I had them forward me steel door and paint submittals for jobs in progress. I wanted to be sure the submittals did not indicate the shop primer was THE primer. David G. Axt, CCS, CSI, SCIP Specifications Consultant Axt Consulting LLC Guest (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Friday, March 12, 2021 - 11:41 am:    For whatever it's worth, if you're subscribed to MasterSpec, their full length painting sections have language to address this (incompatible primers) in the Part 3 "Preparation" article, as well as other language indicating compatibility of paints in the system based on the topcoat.