Archive through March 13, 2017

Log Out | Topics | Search Moderators | Register | Edit Profile

Author Message ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1034 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 02:54 pm:    Hi. I'm sure most of you recall when Bob Johnson of blessed memory conducted this survey back in 2009 (how time flies) - http://discus.4specs.com/cgi-bin/discus/discus.cgi?pg=prev&topic=7868&page=7470 I would like to try it again and see where we are now. Please ask every Specifier you know to participate so we can get some real numbers. Here are the questions. Please scroll to the bottom to insert your answers. What is your current age? Did you receive education beyond high school? What was your major? At what age did you first prepare some significant specifications? Did you have a mentor in specifications? How was the mentor related to you (office, CSI chapter, etc.)? At what age did you first take a formal education seminar or course in specifications? Who provided the education? At what ages did you achieve CDT and CCS (if you took the two tests separately)? Do you have CCCA? At what age did you first become a full-time specifier? A complilation of the above data from a significant number of today's specifier's will provide us good information to compare with what is happening today. To make the complilation easier, please copy and use the following outline for responses: Current age: Higher education: Yes or No Major? Age when first prepared specs: Have a mentor: Yes or No Mentor Relationship: Age at first formal education: Education provider: Age at CDT: Age at CCS: Do you also have CCCA? Age as full-time Specifier: ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1035 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 02:59 pm:    Current age: 61 Higher education: Yes or No - Some Major? Physical Sciences Age when first prepared specs: 21 Have a mentor: Yes or No - Yes Mentor Relationship: Office Age at first formal education: 32 Education provider: DC Metro CSI Age at CDT: N/A Age at CCS: 32 Do you also have CCCA? Yes Age as full-time Specifier: 23 David J. Wyatt, CDT Senior Member Username: david_j_wyatt_cdt Post Number: 162 Registered: 03-2011 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 04:12 pm:    Ken, Thank you for reviving this. Current age: 60 Higher education: Yes Major? Political Science Age when first prepared specs:31 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: CSI Fellow/Honorary Member Bob Johnson Age at first formal education: 42 Education provider: CSI Akron-Canton Age at CDT: 42 Age at CCS: 44 Do you also have CCCA? Yes Age as full-time Specifier: 31 Wayne Yancey Senior Member Username: wayne_yancey Post Number: 800 Registered: 01-2008 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 04:13 pm:    Current age: 69 years, 10 months Higher education: Yes Major? Architectural Technology Age when first prepared specs: 26 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Office Age at first formal education: 20 at graduation Education provider: SAIT Polytechnic, Specification Writers Associaton of Canada (SWAC) the precusor to CSC; CSI Age at CDT: N/A Age at CCS: 43 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 29 Edward J Dueppen, RA, CSI, CCS, LEED AP Senior Member Username: edueppen Post Number: 36 Registered: 08-2013 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 04:18 pm:    Current age: 50 Higher education: YES Major? ARCHITECTURE (M.ARCH) Age when first prepared specs: ABOUT 30 Have a mentor: YES Mentor Relationship: SUPERVISOR Age at first formal education: ABOUT 23 Education provider: UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN - MILWAUKEE Age at CDT: 39 Age at CCS: 46 Do you also have CCCA? NO Age as full-time Specifier: 46 Dewayne Dean Senior Member Username: ddean Post Number: 116 Registered: 02-2016 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 04:26 pm:    Current age: 65 Higher education: Yes Major Construction Management Age when first prepared specs: 63 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Office Age at first formal education: Education provider: Age at CDT: Age at CCS: Do you also have CCCA? Age as full-time Specifier: 63 Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1733 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 04:41 pm:    Current age: 63 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 32 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Supervisor Age at first formal education: define formal? I guess 21 Education provider: Univ of Florida Age at CDT: 41 Age at CCS: 41 Do you also have CCCA? Age as full-time Specifier: 34 George A. Everding, FCSI, CCS, CCCA, AIA Senior Member Username: geverding Post Number: 844 Registered: 11-2004 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 04:59 pm:    Ken- Are you looking for us retired specifiers to respond, or just those still active? My initial thoughts would be that retireds probably shouldn't respond so the results aren't skewed. But it might be interesting to see how many have dropped out of the survey ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1036 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 04:59 pm:    Thanks everyone. Please keep them coming. For "Age at first formal education" please include any formal education you have received regarding spec writing, whether University, your local CSI chapter, an Institute or Regional program, or other form of class focused on Specs. ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1037 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 05:12 pm:    Hi George. Please reply and indicate that you are retired. Wish I could go back in and revise the form! Thanks for asking. Steven Bruneel, AIA, CSI-CDT, LEED-AP, EDAC Senior Member Username: redseca2 Post Number: 569 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 05:33 pm:    Current age: 63 Higher education: Yes Major? Professional Architecture Program Age when first prepared specs: 36 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Senior specifier at SOM Age at first formal education: 20 Education provider: Oregon State/University of Oregon Age at CDT: 50 Age at CCS: Don't Have Do you also have CCCA? Don't Have Age as full-time Specifier: 46 Michael Chusid, RA FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: michael_chusid Post Number: 245 Registered: 10-2003 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 06:32 pm:    Current age: 64 Higher education: Yes or No YES Major? BA - Design, M.Arch Age when first prepared specs: 25 Have a mentor: Yes or No YES - Many Mentor Relationship: Boss, co-worker, CSI members Age at first formal education: Question is vague. Where I lived, nursery school was taken very seriously. I began architecture school around age 24. I began studying specifications seriously around age 34 Education provider: My major specification teacher was Jane Baker, FCSI Age at CDT: I got CCS before CDT existed Age at CCS: 30 Do you also have CCCA? Age as full-time Specifier: 29 Michael Chusid, RA FCSI CCS www.chusid.com www.buildingproduct.guru 818-219-4937 Ruppert Rangel, AIA CCS Senior Member Username: rangel Post Number: 31 Registered: 08-2006 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 06:47 pm:    Jeez, we're a bunch of ol' guys! I hope Social Security has enough money for all of us. What is your current age? 62 Did you receive education beyond high school? Yes What was your major? B of Arch At what age did you first prepare some significant specifications? 28 (after spending two years in the field and two years on the boards drafting with a pencil) Did you have a mentor in specifications? No, OJT. How was the mentor related to you (office, CSI chapter, etc.)? At what age did you first take a formal education seminar or course in specifications? 20. Who provided the education? Houston, TX Chapter CSI. At what ages did you achieve CDT and CCS (if you took the two tests separately)? Do you have CCCA? 32ish for CCS. At what age did you first become a full-time specifier? 29. Lynn Javoroski FCSI CCS LEEDŽ AP SCIP Affiliate Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 2108 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 07:00 pm:    RETIRED, but: Current age: 73 Higher education: Yes Major? BA Psychology and MArch. Age when first prepared specs: 51 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: supervisor Age at first formal education: 53 Education provider: CSI and mentor Age at CDT: 55 Age at CCS: 59 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 52 BUT, add to this that I went back to school for that MArch and graduated with it when I was 42. James Sandoz, AIA, CSI, CCS, CCCA Senior Member Username: jsandoz Post Number: 202 Registered: 06-2005 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 09:19 am:    So far I appear to be the 'baby.' Age: 56 Higher Ed: Yes. B.S. in Biology, Masters in Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 44 Mentor Relationship: Former supervisor Age at first formal education: B.S. at 22, M. Arch at 30 Education provider: Degree, state university; as a specifier, mentor Age at CDT: 39 Age at CCS: 45 CCCA: yes Age as a full-time specifier: 44 FWIW, I, like many of my colleagues, had solid production and construction contract administration experience prior to writing specifications full-time. I believe this is what drew (pardon the pun) me to writing specifications. Richard Howard, AIA FCSI CCS LEED-AP Senior Member Username: rick_howard Post Number: 295 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 09:24 am:    Current age: 65 (no plans to retire) Higher education: Yes Major? BS Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 24 Have a mentor: Not in person, but I credit books by Hans Meier and Harold Rosen, and CSI Manual of Practice in the green, 3-ring binder Mentor Relationship: Age at first formal spec education: 22 Education provider: Ohio State University Age at CDT: N/A Age at CCS: 29 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 31 Chris Sawyer, AIA CCS LEED AP Senior Member Username: csawyer Post Number: 16 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 09:44 am:    Current age: 46 Higher education: Yes Major? English Masters Age when first prepared specs: 28 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Office Age at first formal education: 35 Education provider: CSI NY Metro Age at CDT: 35 Age at CCS: 36 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 30 Chris Sawyer AIA CCS LEED AP G. Wade Bevier, FCSI, CCS, LEED-AP BD+C, SCIPa, USGBC Senior Member Username: wbevier Post Number: 63 Registered: 07-2004 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 11:36 am:    What is your current age? 62 Did you receive education beyond high school? YES What was your major? Photography At what age did you first prepare some significant specifications? 45 Did you have a mentor in specifications? YES How was the mentor related to you (office, CSI chapter, etc.)? Office Specifications Director and significant encourager to achieve certification both CDT and CCS At what age did you first take a formal education seminar or course in specifications? 49 Who provided the education? CSI University At what ages did you achieve CDT and CCS (if you took the two tests separately)? Do you have CCCA? CDT: 46 CCS: 48 CCCA: NO (due to my direct involvement with proctoring or teaching certification exam prep I was/am not allowed to sit for the CCCA test and this situation continued to this day...) At what age did you first become a full-time specifier? 45 Robin E. Snyder Senior Member Username: robin Post Number: 662 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 01:08 pm:    Current age: 50 Higher education: Yes Major? MBA, March, JD Age when first prepared specs: 26 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Supervisor Age at first formal education: 25 Education provider: Internship Age at CDT: 27 Age at CCS: Forgot Do you also have CCCA? Nope Age as full-time Specifier: 30 ish J. Peter Jordan Senior Member Username: jpjordan Post Number: 932 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 01:13 pm:    Current age: 68 Higher education: Yes Major? MBA, BArch, Age when first prepared specs: 30 Have a mentor: No Mentor Relationship: N/A Age at first formal education: 32 Education provider: CSI Age at CDT: N/A Age at CCS: 34 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 31 Years full-time specification writing responsibility: 22 J. Peter Jordan, FCSI, AIA, CCS, LEED AP, SCIP Ronald L. Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP Senior Member Username: specman Post Number: 1436 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 01:39 pm:    Current age: 55 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture (B. Arch) Age when first prepared specs: 23 (but I hadn't a clue as to what I was doing) Have a mentor: Yes, sort of... Mentor Relationship: Various senior architects I worked with, but none in regard to specifications preparation Age at first formal education: 39 Education provider: CSI Age at CDT: 39 Age at CCS: 41 Do you also have CCCA? Yes Age as full-time specifier: 42 Ron Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP www.specsandcodes.com Liz O'Sullivan Senior Member Username: liz_osullivan Post Number: 217 Registered: 10-2011 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 01:48 pm:    Current age: 44 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture (BArch degree) Age when first prepared specs: 35 Have a mentor: Not really, but after writing specs for a few years, I discovered that I have mentor-type colleagues (local and in other places) that I can turn to when I have questions. (Specifiers are amazing that way.) Mentor Relationship: (See above.) Age at first formal education: No formal education, but I consider my first education about specifications to be my self-study work preparing for the CDT exam. I did this on my own, using the CSI Project Resource Manual, in 2007. Education provider: (See above.) Age at CDT: 34 Age at CCS: 37 Do you also have CCCA? Yes Age as full-time Specifier: 35 Margaret G. Chewning FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: presbspec Post Number: 284 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 02:23 pm:    Current age: 64, no plans to retire Higher education: yes Major? BET, Construction Management concentration. Age when first prepared specs: 22 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Hans Meir's Construction Specifications Handbook given to me by my supervisor at Navy Exchange Maintenance. Age at first formal education: In specifications was a seminar in writing government specifications (before SpecsIntact), and self study converting NAVFAC specs into CSI 3part sections for retail renovation work. Education provider: Age at CDT: N/A Age at CCS: 30, circa '83 Do you also have CCCA? Obtained at 46, have dropped this cert as I no longer do Construction Admin Age as full-time Specifier: 28 David Stutzman Senior Member Username: david_stutzman Post Number: 82 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 02:32 pm:    Current age: 64 Higher education: Yes Major? BArch Age when first prepared specs: 24 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Project Manager Age at first formal education: 27 Specifications writing Education provider: Temple University Age at CDT: N/A it didn't exist Age at CCS: 28 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 28 User (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 12:24 pm:    Current age: 72 Higher education: Yes, some Major? Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 30 Have a mentor: No Mentor Relationship: not applicable Age at first formal education: 6 Education provider: RR Public Schools Age at CDT: not applicable Age at CCS: 32 Do you also have CCCA? Yes Age as full-time Specifier: 30 Colin Gilboy Senior Member Username: colin Post Number: 431 Registered: 09-2005 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 02:47 pm:    Current age: 58 Higher education: Bachelor's degree in General Studies Major? First Anthropology and Near Eastern Languages, Second Engineering, Third General Studies Age when first prepared specs: 28 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Boss at first A/E firm Age at first formal education concerning specs: College class with Bowtie Joe McGuire in 1988, I was 30. Education provider: IUPUI Age at CDT: Certificate 1988, age 30 Age at CCS: 1991, age 33 Do you also have CCCA? Yes Age as full-time Specifier: Was 33 when I first became FT specifier [Emailed to me. If you need to update yours, email me the changes and I can edit them as the super user. Colin] Colin Gilboy Publisher, 4specs.com 435.654.5775 - Utah 800.369.8008 Don Harris CSI, CCS, CCCA, AIA Senior Member Username: don_harris Post Number: 293 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 02:52 pm:    Current age: 67 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 30 Have a mentor: Not really but have a network of senior specifiers to mutually lean on. Mentor Relationship: Age at first formal education: 38 Education provider: CSI Seminars and prior to that and forever continuing, the school of hard knocks. Age at CDT: 41 Age at CCS: 44 Do you also have CCCA: Yes Age as full-time Specifier: 45 Brian Payne, AIA Senior Member Username: brian_payne Post Number: 68 Registered: 01-2014 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 02:57 pm:    Current age: 39 (Youngest so far!) Higher education: Yes Major: Architecture Age when first prepared specs: Involved at 23ish Have a mentor: Nope Mentor Relationship: Age at first formal education: What's that? Education provider: N/A Age at CDT: 37 Age at CCS: Not yet. Do you also have CCCA? Nope. Age as full-time Specifier: 35 Richard Baxter, AIA, CSI, CDT Senior Member Username: rbaxter Post Number: 126 Registered: 12-2004 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 03:29 pm:    Current age: 52 Higher education: Yes Major? B of Fine Arts; B of Science of Architecture; Master of Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 37 Have a mentor: No Mentor Relationship: MasterSpec's evaluations sheets. Age at first formal education: 20 Education provider: University of Utah Age at CDT: 48 CCS: 60, maybe. Who knows? Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 37 Guest (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 03:18 pm:    I applaud the effort put into this survey, but ultimately I question what purpose it serves. Aside from a creating a simple profile of an 'average specifier' the last survey back in 2009 was deemed to indicate that, "lack of young specifiers in today's world is not a new story and that most people do not become specifiers until they have been around the 'professional block' a few times and discovered where their talents lie and what part of the profession they are most interested in." While I'm not disputing the findings and the conclusion, I question if this is OK in the industry. Are we happy with the average specifier (from 2009 data) being 55 years old and becoming a full-time specifier at 46? Are we trying to say that specifiers should be younger? ... that they should get started earlier? ... that they need better (or different) education or mentoring? The wording in the conclusions back in 2009 leads me to believe that it is generally understood that there is a lack of young talent among full-time specifiers, but aside from confirming that conclusion, what good did the survey do aside from providing a base point to begin tracking demographic makeup of an average specifier over time? It is a reactive metric, not really something that is helpful for a proactive approach to changing the demographic. Wouldn't it be more productive to try and identify problem areas and create possible solutions to solve those problems? For example: Many respondents (both old and new) have indicated they didn't receive any formal education in specifications. Why is that? Were there not opportunities, or did the respondent not take advantage of available opportunities? Did they feel like on-the-job training was better than any formal education they might have had available (if any at all)? Would specifications in the industry be better if specifiers received more formal education? Are full-time specifiers younger if they receive formal education? Are they more likely to get their CCS or CCCA if they have had formal education in specifications? If someone has had formal specification education, are they more likely to get their CCS sooner or later than their peers who never had any formal education? Many of the same types of questions could be asked about mentorship or the affect of the respondents' field of study in higher education. Together these types of questions can start to paint a better picture of the demographics and the pathways leading to full-time specifiers in the industry. Then, that picture could be used to identify issues and help solve some of those issues. Ultimately my point is that simply aggregating age data and compiling an average doesn't seem very helpful in the long run except to track the demographics of specifiers over time. And while that may be helpful for tracking, it doesn't seem very proactive in addressing demographic problems or challenges in the industry. Shouldn't that be a more worthwhile goal? I keep hearing people worry about specifications in the industry because there isn't a lot of young talent getting into specifications, but aside from worrying, not many seem to be doing anything to address those concerns. George A. Everding, FCSI, CCS, CCCA, AIA Senior Member Username: geverding Post Number: 845 Registered: 11-2004 Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 05:05 pm:    (Retired 2014) Current age: 65 Higher education: Yes Major: Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 32 Mentor: No Mentor Relationship: Age at first formal education: 49 Education provider: CSI, CDT Age at CDT: 52 Age at CCS: 52 Age at CCCA: 53 Age as full-time specifier: 49 Robin E. Snyder Senior Member Username: robin Post Number: 663 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 01:44 pm:    personally, i think its interesting to see and starts to show the "problem areas". Perhaps Guest can put together a proposal that identifies the problems this survey reveals and a clear strategy for addressing them? Guest (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 02:18 pm:    Robin, before I could put together any sort of proposal to address the problems, I'd need to know what you feel the survey is revealing as "problem areas." I'm at a loss as to what problems the survey is revealing, except for the conclusions that were made back in 2009. The original intent of the survey, as posted back then, was to see what the norm was for how we all got started as specifiers. This was supposed to inform us about potential young specifiers. The conclusion back then seemed to be that the average specifier got started later in their career and that the perceived problem with not having young specifiers in the industry isn't really an issue. If everyone is happy with that, then the job is done. Robin E. Snyder Senior Member Username: robin Post Number: 664 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 02:28 pm:    Feel free to offer a different way to gather pertinent information then, if this survey isn't worthwhile, as you mentioned in your post. What's a better approach? Robin E. Snyder Senior Member Username: robin Post Number: 665 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 02:33 pm:    In other words, let's all start offering specific, concrete ways to identify major issues in our profession and manageable, achievable ways to solve them. If this survey starts to identify some, let's build on it if necessary, but this survey may help identify the "next questions" we need to ask. David J. Wyatt, CDT Senior Member Username: david_j_wyatt_cdt Post Number: 163 Registered: 03-2011 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 02:35 pm:    This is in response to Guest above. Whoever you are, your questions and concerns are well-expressed. They are on the minds of most, if not all, of the correspondents here. The 4specs archives are full of meaningful and sometimes impassioned discussions of those issues. Who are we? Where are we? Where are we going? The practical solution for many of the problems, fortunately, is simple: Get up and do something. This is not always easy, but it is simple. When things don't go well, there is a tendency to blame CSI for not fixing them. I don't know how it possibly could. An organization can only go as fast and as far as the bulk of its members will push it and the budgets will allow. In this case, I think the bulk of CSI members are satisfied with what the organization provides - document standards, education, and networking opportunities. They pay their dues, go to the meetings, and go about their lives. To them that's good enough. Occasionally a new person brings a high level of energy to the group. Liz O'Sullivan and Cherise Lakeside come to mind as providing refreshing points of view in recent years. However, they can only do so much to cause change. It is easy to say, "Somebody needs to do something about...." If you find yourself saying this, remember that you are somebody and that you have the power to work locally to solve some problems. The CSI Chapter system makes it possible to collect energy and direct it to a good result. If you want to encourage one of those extraordinary few to continue their tireless striving for the good, nominate them for and Institute Award or Fellowship. Some years hence, they might receive Honorary status for being movers and shakers. Meanwhile, we are collecting information here. It is sort of like counting how many pandas are left. We just want to know. Liz O'Sullivan Senior Member Username: liz_osullivan Post Number: 218 Registered: 10-2011 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 02:43 pm:    Thanks for the shout-out, David! David J. Wyatt, CDT Senior Member Username: david_j_wyatt_cdt Post Number: 164 Registered: 03-2011 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 02:52 pm:    Thank YOU. You're doing good hard work. ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1039 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 03:12 pm:    Great idea Robin. Guest, how about it? You sound passionate about this topic. We can always use dynamic leaders with vision. Sometimes all people need is a little nudge. I just crunched some numbers. Out of the 26 responses so far, the average age of active Specifiers is 59 with maximum at 72, minimum at 39, and median at 62. So yes, we're aging compared with the 2009 study. What I'm finding troubling isn't that we all started out old but that we don't seem to be attracting young-uns to replace us. According to responses, including retirees, the average age at first spec written is 30. Where are today's 30 year olds? Spec education average is 31-1/2. How many of us are participating in CDT/CCS/CCCA training? What kind of turnout are we getting? Average age at CDT is 41; CCS is 39 (a lot of us got our CCS before there was a CDT); and becoming a full-time Specifier is 37. I know many people in the Institute have tried to approach Architecture schools about including Specifying as part of their curricula with minimal success. I do not know of anyone approaching Engineering schools. Most of us weren't all that "advanced" in age when we decided to become FT Specifiers though the range of becoming FT Specifiers in our study is from 23 to 63. Why aren't there more young people joining our ranks? Are we complaining too much and scaring people away? I've had young people tell me that they find me intimidated (anyone who knows me hopefully doesn't find me intimidating in any way and lately I've had more 'friendly' feedback); does anyone else get that kind of feedback? What do you think is the criteria for someone getting involved in becoming a Specifier? Any ideas on how to entice people to get started? I'm trying to get more Project Architects to require the people detailing the work to begin the spec edits so they can see what is in their Sections. It's a great way to mentor people and also to reduce the number of useless notes on the Drawings. What are your thoughts? Please send the link to this survey to everyone you know who writes specs. Maybe see if you can distribute it to others in your CSI Chapters. The more people who participate the better the dialogue. Best regards to all, Ken Cynie Linton Senior Member Username: cynie_linton Post Number: 28 Registered: 10-2010 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 03:20 pm:    Current age: 60 Higher education: Yes Major: BFA Printmaking + Art Ed, MARCH Age when first prepared specs: 39 Have a mentor: Yes, various Mentor Relationship: Through CSI and work Age at first formal education: 40 Education provider: Local Chapter Age at CDT: 40 Age at CCS: Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier 40 ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1040 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 03:25 pm:    David, great points. Someone should do something. I've been trying to 'do something' for about 40 years in this industry. Frankly I'm getting old and I'm tired. Thankfully I am stumbling across several truly intelligent people who are seeing how specs are more than a necessary evil. Perhaps they will become FT Specifiers. If not, perhaps they will be able to encourage others to follow the path. I pray there are still people who will be able to teach and mentor those new members of our little clan. Dave Metzger Senior Member Username: davemetzger Post Number: 678 Registered: 07-2001 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 03:29 pm:    There have been postings on 4specs on this and related topics going back more than a decade. I don’t understand why the lack of young specifiers is viewed by some as a problem. “Young” is a relative term; when I started writing specifications full-time in 1989 I was 43, and I was one of the younger specifiers in our CSI chapter. Now, as I approach middle age(!), I see that the younger respondents to the survey continue to be 40ish--plus įa change, plus c'est la męme chose. The point is that having prior experience in design (design development, construction documents) to understand the process of design, of building codes, of documentation, and in construction contract administration to understand the realities of how buildings are built, of tolerances, of how contract documents are interpreted by different parties with different and sometimes conflicting interests, is a valuable prerequisite to become an effective specifier. And that experience takes years to acquire. Of course it can be acquired in multiple ways; the survey amply demonstrated that there are as many paths to becoming a specifier as there are specifiers, no one path any more valid than another. But specifying deals much more with applied knowledge and experience than it does with theory, and that applied knowledge and experience is not acquired in school. I think people can become interested in specifying when they’ve had enough experience to see how specifications are used and the value they have, both as a tool during design, and as a means to enforce design intent and contract requirements during construction; when they understand that specifying is a means to integrate the art and science of architecture; that it’s a way to keep educating oneself; that it combines both doing and teaching; and yes, that it’s fun. Chris Sawyer, AIA CCS LEED AP Senior Member Username: csawyer Post Number: 17 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 03:38 pm:    Perhaps we are at a saturation point for opportunity for full-time spec writers? The architecture industry went through significant reduction in the last downturn and there is a general problem of finding qualified professionals across the architecture field. The number of people in any architectural area is still below peak I think. A dedicated spec writer (in-house or consultant) is usually a luxury for most firms and projects (which are small on average). The level of available jobs seems stable with openings occurring when people retire or choose to do something else. As a practical concern, is there really room for more spec writers? Chris Sawyer AIA CCS LEED AP Steven Bruneel, AIA, CSI-CDT, LEED-AP, EDAC Senior Member Username: redseca2 Post Number: 570 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 03:38 pm:    This constant aging seems to be a problem with several of the organizations that are very important to me and that I support in addition to CSI. I have season tickets to the San Francisco Opera and each year the average attendee's age seems to increase one year. A couple years ago they faced reality and moved up the start of performances 1 hour so we could all get to bed in time. I also have season tickets (same seats forever) to the San Francisco Symphony, where I also see my seat mates grow older each year. the Music Director, Michael Tilson Thomas, was a very young man the first time I saw him perform, and now he is in his seventies. I can't worry about this, each organization is tops in its field. David J. Wyatt, CDT Senior Member Username: david_j_wyatt_cdt Post Number: 165 Registered: 03-2011 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 04:07 pm:    Yogi would have said, "If people don't want to be specification writers, there's nothing we can do to stop them." Ron Beard CCS Senior Member Username: rm_beard_ccs Post Number: 439 Registered: 10-2002 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 04:16 pm:    What year did the CCS program begin? "Fast is good, but accurate is better." .............Wyatt Earp ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1041 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 04:32 pm:    Chris, the way I see it, Specifiers need to be baptized in fire long before they're comfortable doing this full-time. Waiting for the old guard to die off or retire probably isn't a good way to find mentors who can clear the path for them. I agree with Dave Metzger that most Specifiers have a background in CA and other hard-way forms of indoctrination into our business. I was lucky to work for 4 years under an older guy who had more patience than Job and a warped sense of humor that allowed me to plow into walls, extricate myself, and do it again. Looking back along the way I had no idea what I was getting myself into, no idea what I was doing, and a safety net of incredible people who had my back and who made me appear credible. Wait, that's still happening now isn't it? Maybe. Anyway, I got lucky and found out that I enjoy doing this but I'm a little strange that way. Steve Groth (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 04:34 pm:    Current age: 58 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture (BArch) Age when first prepared specs: 26 Have a mentor: No Mentor Relationship: Age at first formal education: Assuming you're asking about specification education, CDT Study Session Education provider: CSI chapter Age at CDT: 35 Age at CCS: 36 Do you also have CCCA? No, but keep thinking about it Age as full-time Specifier: N/A Jon Shaw CSC CDT (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 04:30 pm:    From the great white North: Current age: 66 Higher education: Yes Age when first prepared specs: 50 Have a mentor: No Mentor Relationship: Age at first formal education:21 Education provider: Vancouver Vocational Age at CDT: 57 Age at CCS: Do you also have CCCA? Age as full-time Specifier:64 Chris Sawyer, AIA CCS LEED AP Senior Member Username: csawyer Post Number: 18 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 04:50 pm:    Ken, I agree that waiting for opportunities is perhaps not the best way to get into the field; however, I find that people get pulled into doing specs because there is a need and an opportunity. Rarely is being a spec writer something that one has designs on becoming at a “younger” age. My thesis is that with only limited opportunities there are no incentives for younger people to pursue. There are local pockets of respected expertise and successful practitioners but it doesn’t seem to be a growing profession from my point of view. Chris Sawyer AIA CCS LEED AP Jerry Glass (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 04:50 pm:    Current age: 70 (Almost retired) Higher education: Yes Major? Bachelor of Science in Industrial Arts 1969 Age when first prepared specs: 26 Have a mentor: No - Opened drafting department in marketing office, obtained SpecText and learned by doing. Mentor Relationship: Age at first formal education: 37 Education provider: Denver CSI Chapter Age at CDT: 55 Age at CCS: 57 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier:65 Isaac Tevet (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 05:31 pm:    Current age: 70 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 25 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Co-worker Age at first formal education: Education provider: Portland CSI Age at CDT: NA Age at CCS: NA Do you also have CCCA? NA Age as full-time Specifier: 40 Ann Baker (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 06:05 pm:    Current age: 67 Post-secondary education: yes Major: English, then Architecture Age at first specs: 32-ish Mentor:Not early on, but in the last 15 years, yes How was the mentor related to you? Co-worker, and pretty much every other specifier I know First formal education seminar or course in specifications? Probably 40-ish Who provided the education? CSI, San Antonio Chapter CDT: 45 CCS: 54 CCCA: 50 Full-time specifier: 53-ish Ann G. Baker, RA, CSI, CCS, CCCA, SCIP, LEED AP BD+C Senior Member Username: ann Post Number: 7 Registered: 03-2013 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 06:19 pm:    I tried to edit my post but apparently wasn't logged in when I posted so the system won't allow an edit. I just wanted to add that, similarly to Lynn, I did not earn my architecture degree right after high school - I was 30. So I got a late start in architecture in general, in specification writing in particular. Scott Sider (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 06:14 pm:    Current age: 60 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture. Have Barch, 1980. Age when first prepared specs: 29 Have a mentor: Not currently, but yes in the past. Currently am a mentor. Mentor Relationship: Supervisor Age at first formal education: 18 Education provider: Anne Arundel Community College, then University of Maryland Age at CDT: Didn't exist when I got my CCS Age at CCS: 32 Do you also have CCCA? Yes. Age as full-time Specifier: 37. Not currently doing specifications full time. Mostly do construction administration with specifications part time. Ron Beard CCS Senior Member Username: rm_beard_ccs Post Number: 440 Registered: 10-2002 Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2017 - 01:04 am:    Current age: 76 Higher education: Yes Major? Civil Engineering Age when first prepared specs: 26 Have a mentor: Yes, Everett Spurling, FAIA FCSI Mentor Relationship: Employer and CSI member Age at first formal education: 32 Education provider: DC Metro CSI Age at CDT: Not available Age at CCS: 37; based on CCS starting in 1978 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 30 "Fast is good, but accurate is better." .............Wyatt Earp Anne Whitacre, FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: awhitacre Post Number: 1416 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2017 - 01:30 am:    Current age: 63 Higher education: Yes or No yes Major? History Age when first prepared specs: 24 Have a mentor: Yes or No yes, I worked in a department with 4 other specifiers Mentor Relationship: boss Age at first formal education: 26 Education provider: CSI Age at CDT: none. got the CCS at 28 Age at CCS: 28, before there was a CDT Do you also have CCCA? no Age as full-time Specifier:24 Anne Whitacre, FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: awhitacre Post Number: 1417 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2017 - 01:39 am:    its interesting to me that for all the whining about how old we are, there are a lot of us who did our first set of specs at the age of 30 or younger --0 and have been doing this for a long time. I think an additional question would be: why did you start writing spec? Lynn Javoroski FCSI CCS LEEDŽ AP SCIP Affiliate Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 2109 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2017 - 11:21 am:    To answer Anne's question: At a small Architectural firm, I was surveying for the ADA and suggesting solutions for non-conformance. The head of the firm told me I could write "specifications" for the drawings, but that he would have to write Division 1 because it was too complicated. And that was a challenge I couldn't resist. Shortly after that, the firm closed, and the head of the firm secured me an interview with another, larger firm as a spec writer. That was on a Friday; they hired me and I started on Monday. I was unemployed for a weekend and became a full-time spec writer in 1994. Alex Sperfeld New member Username: asperfeld Post Number: 1 Registered: 01-2017 Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2017 - 11:55 am:    Current age: 43 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 28 Have a mentor: No Mentor Relationship: n/a Age at first formal education: 43 Education provider: CSI (CDT Prep Class) Age at CDT: 43 Age at CCS: n/a Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier:43 Vivian Volz, AIA, CSI, CCS Senior Member Username: vivianvolz Post Number: 164 Registered: 06-2004 Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2017 - 12:05 pm:    Current age: 48 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 31 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Specifier in another office of my large architecture firm Age at first formal SPEC education: 31 Education provider: mentor and CSI Age at CDT: 33 Age at CCS: 35? Do you also have CCCA? no Age as full-time Specifier: 33 (part time at 32) Why? Was primarily doing CA, but expecting my child. Had written just a couple of specifications. Thought I'd write specifications a couple of years... still going, and the child is 15. Liz O'Sullivan Senior Member Username: liz_osullivan Post Number: 219 Registered: 10-2011 Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2017 - 08:28 pm:    Why did I start writing specs? I did CA on a medium-sized project as a young person, right before I got licensed. I managed the project from SD through the end. I did not coordinate with our specifications consultant, my boss did that. But as soon as construction started, I immediately understood how important the specs are. After that, if I was on a project in any capacity (project architect, job captain, even just an extra hand) I was the person who coordinated with our specifications consultant. I liked doing it, and no one else did. One of the people writing specs for the consulting firm was a young woman who had little kids. When I started thinking about having kids, I realized that this type of work would be a good fit for me while I had young kids. I talked to her one day about it - she was working on a contract basis, project-by-project. This sounded ideal. I just didn't see how I could keep up the pace of work (the time, stress, and mental energy) that being a project architect in a small firm demanded. So, in summary - I started writing specs because it seemed like work in my field that I could manage while also managing little kids. I had assumed I'd go back to working as an architect later, but it turns out that writing specs is a really good fit for me. And, an observation - I do not know if I would be doing this work if I hadn't seen the example of this other young woman in a similar situation doing this work. Keep this in mind for the mentoring and recruiting discussions - people don't know about what they never even see. People who feel the need to replace themselves need to be at least visible to potential replacements. And - people who feel that they have nothing whatsoever in common with someone else who's doing a certain job may not be able to visualize themselves doing that job. DBishton (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Sunday, January 22, 2017 - 03:33 pm:    What is your current age? 63 Did you receive education beyond high school? Yes What was your major? Architecture At what age did you first prepare some significant specifications? 26 Did you have a mentor in specifications? Yes How was the mentor related to you (office, CSI chapter, etc.)? Office. But I did not know that he was a mentor until after he left and I was asked to fill his position. At what age did you first take a formal education seminar or course in specifications? 26 Who provided the education? University of Wisconsin, Madison At what ages did you achieve CDT and CCS (if you took the two tests separately)? Do you have CCCA? CDT: 49 CCS: 52 CCCA: 57 At what age did you first become a full-time specifier? 26 Ed Storer Senior Member Username: ed_storer Post Number: 12 Registered: 05-2009 Posted on Sunday, January 22, 2017 - 07:46 pm:    Current age: Almost 67. Higher education: Yes or No YES. Major? Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 28 Have a mentor: Yes or No YES Mentor Relationship: Office Age at first formal education: 29 Education provider: U Wisconsin Extension Age at CDT: Not available in 1983 Age at CCS: 33 Do you also have CCCA? NO Age as full-time Specifier: 28 David R. Combs, Assoc. AIA, CSI, CCCA, LEED AP Senior Member Username: davidc Post Number: 6 Registered: 02-2015 Posted on Monday, January 23, 2017 - 07:07 am:    Current age: 56 Higher education: Yes Major? 2 yrs Construction Engineering; 2 yrs Architecture. Age when first prepared specs: 28 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Spec writer at competing firm (and fellow member of local CSI Chapter) Age at first formal education: 31 Education provider: CDT/CCS Study Class, Central PA Chapter (self-taught prior to that). Age at CDT: 31 Age at CCS: 31 Do you also have CCCA? Yes Age as full-time Specifier: 30 David R. Combs, Assoc. AIA, CSI, CCCA, LEED AP Associate Principal Regional Director of Operations Jim Zulkoskey (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Monday, January 23, 2017 - 08:25 am:    Current age: 75 Higher education: Yes Major? Architectural technology Age when first prepared specs:35 Have a mentor: No Mentor Relationship: Age at first formal education:25 Education provider: Saskatchewan Institute of Technology Age at CDT: Age at CCS: Do you also have CCCA? no Age as full-time Specifier: 70 Margaret G. Chewning FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: presbspec Post Number: 285 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Monday, January 23, 2017 - 10:38 am:    Another question that would be interesting to know would be if you have a AR or PE registration? As for getting started, it was part of my first job in a retail maintenance department and as I moved around to various Architectural firms I did drafting and specs; found I liked doing the specs more than drawings, so tended to specialize there. After obtaining my BET at ODU, I never worked toward my registration. Only place that held me back was an opportunity to work at LantDiv spec department. I agree with Liz above about being able to work specs consulting with raising children, especially now that I'm caring for my granddaughter. ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1045 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Monday, January 23, 2017 - 11:20 am:    What excellent comments! I've started another thread to share our stories here: http://discus.4specs.com/discus/messages/23/8275.html?1485188382 Please share. Charles Coleman (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Monday, January 23, 2017 - 11:26 am:    Current age: 61 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 56 Have a mentor: Yes, still do. Mentor Relationship: Co-worker. Age at first formal education: 56 Education provider: Mentor Age at CDT: 26 Age at CCS: In progress Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 56 Dan Kammerer (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Monday, January 23, 2017 - 12:05 pm:    Current age: 52 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture Age when first prepared specs: 28 Have a mentor: No, not till later Mentor Relationship: Co-worker Age at first formal education: 50 Education provider: CSI Age at CDT: 48 Age at CCS: None Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier:45 Jeremy Shelton New member Username: jeremys Post Number: 1 Registered: 01-2017 Posted on Monday, January 23, 2017 - 01:42 pm:    Current age: 39 Higher education: Yes Major? Architecture (BArch) Age when first prepared specs: 29 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Co-worker Age at first formal education: 29 Education provider: CSI CDT Class Age at CDT: 29 Age at CCS: 32 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: N/A Jeremy Shelton, AIA, CSI, LEED AP Architect Dekker/Perich/Sabatini Beth Stroshane (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Monday, January 23, 2017 - 03:21 pm:    Current age: 39 Higher education: Yes Major? BS Structural Engineer/BS Construction management Age when first prepared specs: 28 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: co-worker, specifier at different firm Age at first formal education: this is a misnomer. There is no formal education that I can actually find even now. Education provider: CSI Academy, co-workers, self taught, product reps, architects, engineers, admins. Age at CDT: 28 Age at CCS: 29 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier:28 The fact that you are asking these questions on this forum is why you are getting the answers you are getting. There are many younger specifiers in Seattle they just don't frequent this forum. Alan Itzkowitz New member Username: aitzkowitz Post Number: 1 Registered: 11-2012 Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2017 - 10:44 am:    Current age: 66 Higher education: Yes Major? BArch in Structures and MBA Age when first prepared specs: 30 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Specifier at clients' office Age at first formal education: 30 Education provider: Local CSI Chapters Age at CDT: 39 Age at CCS: 39 Do you also have CCCA? Yes, at age 48 Age as full-time Specifier: 57 Alan Itzkowitz, FCSI, CCS, CCCA J. Peter Jordan Senior Member Username: jpjordan Post Number: 933 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2017 - 11:52 am:    I think Ms. Stroshane's comments are appropriate. If you only talk to the choir, you would think the entire church service should be music. That being said, however, this is the forum many of us are most familiar with. J. Peter Jordan, FCSI, AIA, CCS, LEED AP, SCIP Don Harris CSI, CCS, CCCA, AIA Senior Member Username: don_harris Post Number: 294 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2017 - 05:48 pm:    Just an aside to all this. A long time hardware rep came in to introduce me to their new specifier. She was all of maybe 26, an architecture graduate and when asked, she said she loved architecture but wanted to be on the technical side. She said she had already done 6 months of training and was now ready to go. So, there are some young people that actually want to do what we do, even though it is all hardware. David J. Wyatt, CDT Senior Member Username: david_j_wyatt_cdt Post Number: 167 Registered: 03-2011 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2017 - 09:00 am:    Many competent people of all ages working for architects, engineers, or product manufacturers are writing specifications. However, they may not be labeling themselves as specification writers nor want to. People in the product world may prefer to identify themselves as technical directors or quality assurance representatives because their duties and abilities extend beyond specifications. People in design may prefer to be called project managers for the same reasons. "Specifier" may be too limiting in its connotation for them. The old school specification writers who are well-represented in this forum understand this. In the course of a day, we may find ourselves - apart from writing specifications - meeting with product representatives, reviewing bids, administering construction, and troubleshooting technical issues on drawings. These labeling issues notwithstanding, I am not ready to advocate abandoning the title of specifier, even though it is a term of art that every spell-check in the world red flags. Marorie K. Dickstein, AIA, CCS, NCARB, LEED AP BD+C, MCPPO New member Username: marorie_k_dickstein_aia_ccs_ncarb_leed_ap_bdc_mcppo Post Number: 1 Registered: 01-2017 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2017 - 10:11 am:    Current age: 49 Higher education: Yes Major? M.Arch, BA Urban Studies, and BFA in Environmental Design Age when first prepared specs: 28 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Coworkers at several firms Age at first formal education: 24 Education provider: Architecture school, AIA & CSI & insurance providers' continuing ed Age at CDT: 44 Age at CCS: 48 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 39 (1st stint), 47 (2nd/current) Marjorie Dickstein, AIA, CCS, NCARB, LEED AP BD+C, MCPPO ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1046 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2017 - 10:12 am:    Thanks Beth. Great hearing from you. Please feel free to pass this along to anyone you know who generates specs, including those who are not dedicated Specifiers. I was very hesitant to include the "full-time Specifier" line in the survey in large part due to David's excellent points. Perhaps a better question would have been "What role do you play in the design/construction process?". ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1047 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2017 - 10:14 am:    Marjorie, thanks for your input and welcome to 4specs.com discussion forum. James Sandoz, AIA, CSI, CCS, CCCA Senior Member Username: jsandoz Post Number: 203 Registered: 06-2005 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2017 - 10:37 am:    In response to Ken's question "What role do you play in the design/construction process?" I do everything David Wyatt mentions and then some. As a licensed architect I sometimes hear myself defending the fact that I am not "only a spec writer." Some colleagues (only a few, most know better) do think of me as a specification vending machine until they need something more then I magically become THE guru or perhaps the "fool on the hill." ;-) ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1048 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2017 - 11:07 am:    Wow James, you're elevated to the hill? I've finally managed to climb out of the "pit" (but not out of the fire). When I was working with Bob Johnson we were officially regarded as the "Technical Resources Group" but everyone still referred to us as "spec writers" when they referred to us at all. Another question: In the event CSI rebrands itself away from "Construction Specifications Institute," what would you like the new name to be? Sheldon Wolfe Senior Member Username: sheldon_wolfe Post Number: 950 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2017 - 01:04 pm:    Oh, Ken, please don't start that one again. CSI has spent far too much on consultants and rebranding already. David J. Wyatt, CDT Senior Member Username: david_j_wyatt_cdt Post Number: 168 Registered: 03-2011 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2017 - 01:42 pm:    Thank you, Ken, for reviving this topic. The discussions are good. I agree with Sheldon about re-branding. CSI leaders can adjust the slogans and the mission statements all they want, but they should not change the name. Re-naming something to attract more members is a waste of time and money in most cases. My wife and I volunteer for a not-for-profit organization whose membership numbers have fallen in the last 6-7 years. The national executives tweaked the mission statement, changed the organization's colors, and lowered the annual dues to stop the bleeding. Nothing changed. At one point, they spent lots of donated money to a consultant (who was also a member) to explore a name change as a way to increase membership. $60,000 and two years later, the consultant concluded that the organization's name was not the problem. The growth of competing organizations and the downturn in the national economy were determined to be more likely causes. The parallels with CSI were uncanny. My wife thought I was making them up when I pointed out the similarities. Sometimes I think writing specifications is like licorice. Not that many people like licorice, but those who do - well, it's all they talk about. The Licorice Association would like to grow its numbers, but it hasn't been able to do it yet. And changing the name will not help. ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1050 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2017 - 02:09 pm:    David, apparently they branched out: https://www.specialtyfood.com/specialty-food-association/about-us/ Richard L Matteo, AIA, CSI, CCS Senior Member Username: rlmat Post Number: 680 Registered: 10-2003 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2017 - 02:46 pm:    Ken - I just saw this - here is my info: Current age:71 going on 72 Higher education: Yes or No Yes BA Major? Sociology Age when first prepared specs: 24 Have a mentor: Yes or No Yes Mentor Relationship: Project Manager in Office Age at first formal education: 56 Education provider: Phoenix CSI Age at CDT: 56 Age at CCS: 59 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 51 Brian Wolf New member Username: brianwolf Post Number: 1 Registered: 01-2017 Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2017 - 10:43 pm:    Current age: 53 Higher education: Yes Major? BS Structural Design and Construction Engineering Technology, PENN STATE Age when first prepared specs: 21 Have a mentor: Yes Mentor Relationship: Office Business Practice Mgr Age at first formal education: 21 Education provider: Employer and CSI Age at CDT: NA Age at CCS: 27 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 21 Christopher Atwood (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Monday, January 30, 2017 - 12:36 pm:    Current age: 62 Higher education: Yes, BS Arch Major? Arch Age when first prepared specs: 25-ish Have a mentor: Mostly no. Mentor Relationship: Minor guidance from early supervisors, but mostly learned by examining prior project manuals, reading various spec writing books, and association with CSI members. Age at first formal education: 44 Education provider: Local CSI Chapter - CDT prep course Age at CDT: 44 Age at CCS: 44 Do you also have CCCA? No Age as full-time Specifier: 43 Ronald J. Ray, RA, CCS, CCCA, CSI, AIA Senior Member Username: rjray Post Number: 150 Registered: 04-2004 Posted on Saturday, March 11, 2017 - 02:47 pm:    Ken, how about a final numbes crunch? ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1059 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Saturday, March 11, 2017 - 03:07 pm:    Been buried at work. I'll try to get it done this week. Thanks for the reminder. Sheldon Wolfe Senior Member Username: sheldon_wolfe Post Number: 957 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Sunday, March 12, 2017 - 10:32 pm:    Another survey. What positions do specifiers hold? How many are considered very valuable? How many are principals, associate principals, directors, gurus, or whatever? I know there isn't a lot of consistency in titles (everyone in sales is a vice president), but they are an expression of what firms think about their employees. Obviously, a survey like this would exclude those companies who are specification consultants. One of Bob's surveys included salary information. I believe it was introduced after the basic survey was going, and it was changed as later responders refined the question. Titles are one thing, but, at least in this country, pay seems to be the best gauge of an employer's view of its employees. You can be Chief Ultimate Officer of Everything, but your pay may show that you're on a par with the Chief Cook and Bottle Washer (no offense to cooks or bottle washers). This is a summary I made from the salary information in Bob's survey. The information was furnished in 2005, so at the end I adjusted the final numbers using cost of living statistics, and got an average salary of just under $100,000. There are many problems with the information in the table. The issue of bonuses was added after the survey was underway. Some reported it and some didn't; some said they got a bonus but didn't state an amount, and many didn't mention it at all; some are consultants and some are kept specifiers. The higher salary numbers typically came from independent specifiers, who may have been reporting gross income, and who have expenses not faced by in-house specifiers. Still, it's a rough indicator of what specifiers make. How many specifiers are there? According to an AIA report from a few years ago, about 90 percent of firms have fewer than 50 employees. My experience indicates offices don't have dedicated specifiers until they have about 40 employees. Based on those numbers, it appears that about 15 to 20 percent of firms have specifiers. It's interesting that the AIA salary survey doesn't recognize the existence of specifiers, though I have been told that they will be included in future surveys. According to CSI, there are about 700 CCS members. Lynn Javoroski FCSI CCS LEEDŽ AP SCIP Affiliate Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 2113 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Sunday, March 12, 2017 - 10:43 pm:    It seems the salaries are higher on the coasts than they are in the middle, but I just scanned the summary; I couldn't sort it for location. (That would be logical as I think the cost of living is also higher on the coasts.) As to the AIA recognizing the existence of specifiers, I'll be surprised when they do. George A. Everding, FCSI, CCS, CCCA, AIA Senior Member Username: geverding Post Number: 849 Registered: 11-2004 Posted on Monday, March 13, 2017 - 01:15 pm:    AIA salary study used to include specifiers as a category 20+ years ago. I used it as a resource when negotiating. The salary study only included specifiers (as well as some other specialities) when there were enough responses to warrant inclusion. You'd be more likely to find specifiers in the national, regional, or bigger state recaps than in the local or smaller state recaps within the survey. Specifiers as a category was dropped in recent versions of the survey. I wonder if that is because the overall numbers of dedicated specifiers within AIA firms has dropped to a point where it is no longer statistically valid to include, rather than some innate bias on the part of the AIA against specifiers (and I am not arguing that it doesn't exist). You're right, Lynn, coastal salaries were usually higher than for those of us "stuck in the middle," and the bigger urban areas usually outpaced the smaller ones. Too bad for us, but we apparently make up for the salary discrepancy in the midwest, because "all the women are strong, all the men are good looking, and all the children are above average." Lynn Javoroski FCSI CCS LEEDŽ AP SCIP Affiliate Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 2114 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Monday, March 13, 2017 - 01:58 pm:    In my last position, I was fortunate enough to work for a company with offices on both coasts, so salaries were commensurate with those on the coasts. I remember using one survey (by AIA?) comparing specifier salaries in the first position I had as a specifier. The company wasn't even close, and I demanded more money. They wouldn't and I left. Of course, I already had something else lined up. Oh, George - I miss Lake Woebegone.