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313 -- Eastside
Member
Username: russell_john

Post Number: 3
Registered: 03-2009
Posted on Monday, May 24, 2010 - 06:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

I have been asked about Citadel composite panels – compared to Alucobond or Reynobond composite panel brands. The suggestion is that Citadel products differ from Alucobond or Reynobond in that they are not adhered by similar methods and therefore subject to oil canning? Thoughts on this matter…??? Can that be said about most products other than the three listed?
Dave Metzger
Senior Member
Username: davemetzger

Post Number: 356
Registered: 07-2001
Posted on Monday, May 24, 2010 - 11:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Alucobond and Reynobond (among others) are manufactured by continuously factory-bonding two metal facings to a solid, extruded thermoplastic core, without the use of adhesives.

I am not familiar with Citadel panels. From a quick look at their website and product descriptions, it appears as if their panels are manufactured by laminating facing sheets to various core materials.
Sean Walker (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 10:41 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

It is true that the manufacturing process is different for Alucobond(tm), Reynobond(tm), and Alpolic(tm) when compared to the Envelope 2000(tm) metal composite material produced by Citadel Architectural Products, Inc.

One is a continuous run production, the other is a batch run production. Both have inherent pros and cons.

However, what is not true is that they do not use adhesives... The 'specification' that requires a manufacturer to produce the MCM 'without the use of glues or adhesives' is inaccurate.

In their literature, it is referred to as a 'tie layer' or 'bonding layer'. Basically, this is a non-descript way of saying 'adhesive'.

The adhesive they use is a dry roll film that is activated with heat. This is in contrast to the liquid adhesive activated by moisture for the batch process.

Citadel utilizes a thermoset phenolic core as opposed to a thermoplastic core utilized by the other manufacturers. Again, both have inherent pros and cons.

The bottom line is that all of the MCMs within the industry are evaluated by the same code bodies and publish the same relative test data---in many of these ASTMs, Citadel equals or exceeds the performance of some of the better known competition, including ASTM D1781 bond strength (or peel strength).

Oil canning is a function of the expansion/contraction of an aluminum sheet material during heating and cooling cycles. This is greatly reduced if not elimated altogether by combining the material into a composite sheet (similar to a solid piece of wood versus the dimensional stability gained by a plywood comprised of several layers). This is true for nearly all manufacturers regardless of production methods.

It is certainly is not the intent to malign any of the products mentioned by offering this information. Alucobond(tm), Reynobond(tm), and Alpolic(tm) are fine products... There just seems to be some misinformation out there regarding their production.

I would be happy to answer any direct questions or send along a comparison of the testing/characteristics of the products mentioned above.

Sean Walker
Marketing Manager
Citadel Architectural Products, Inc.
(800) 446-8828
(Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 02:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

MCM? Military Courts Martial? Marine Corps Marathon? (Hey, I'm in Washington, DC!)
Ronald L. Geren, AIA, CSI, CCS, CCCA, SCIP
Senior Member
Username: specman

Post Number: 856
Registered: 03-2003


Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 03:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Metal Composite Material
Ron Geren, AIA, CSI, CCS, CCCA, SCIP
www.specsandcodes.com
George A. Everding, AIA, CSI, CCS, CCCA
Senior Member
Username: geverding

Post Number: 531
Registered: 11-2004


Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 07:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

MCM = 1900
George A. Everding AIA CSI CCS CCCA
Cannon Design - St. Louis, MO

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