AWS Custom Grade Question

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Author Message Robin E. Snyder Senior Member Username: robin Post Number: 370 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Friday, August 12, 2011 - 11:37 am:    I am out of my office and don't have my AWS book with me, so if anyone has a moment to help me... The contractor has submitted blind dado construction for the cabinets with glue and staples and blind dado on unfinished ends and glue and blind dado with clamps on finished ends. I want to verify this is acceptable for Custom cabinet construction. Any assistance is appreciated! Richard L Matteo, AIA, CSI, CCS Senior Member Username: rlmat Post Number: 438 Registered: 10-2003 Posted on Friday, August 12, 2011 - 11:47 am:    Robyn, I would contact Brad Roa brad@woodinst.com or Tom Cavanaugh thomas@woodinst.com Both are Directors of Architectural Services for the Woodwork Institute Brad handles So. Cal, Arizona & So. Nevada I you are unable to reach either of them, you can call me at 909.481.9941 Robin E. Snyder Senior Member Username: robin Post Number: 371 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Friday, August 12, 2011 - 11:51 am:    Thanks Richard - I emailed Brad. Wayne Yancey Senior Member Username: wayne_yancey Post Number: 487 Registered: 01-2008 Posted on Friday, August 12, 2011 - 11:59 am:    Robin, I would say yes. AWS lists 3 types of dado joints: through, blind, and stop. Blind being a variation on the "through" dado with applied edges "stopping" or concealing dado groove. Bradley Roa, Director of Architectural Services Member Username: bradley_roa Post Number: 3 Registered: 08-2010 Posted on Friday, August 12, 2011 - 01:15 pm:    Section 10, Paragraph 4.4.20.5, JOINERY requires DADOES, LOCK JOINTS, PLOWS, RABBETS, DOWELS, DOWEL SCREWS, or BISCUIT-JOINING PLATES. Paragraph 4.4.4.5, DADOES or LOCK JOINTS shall NOT run though the edgeband. That would make all dadoes and rabbet joints required to be "blind" and don't show from the front. William C. Pegues, FCSI, CCS Senior Member Username: wpegues Post Number: 841 Registered: 10-2002 Posted on Friday, August 12, 2011 - 01:21 pm:    Robin, I would definitely wait for an official response on this. The reason that I say this is that the standard lists all materials specifically including the use of pin nails and staples. And staples are only mentioned with square shouldered construction which is only acceptable in economy. The overall construction system may be acceptable - but the use of staples may disqualify it. Staples are usually making up for something not quite done right, they are not necessarily increasing the quality. You might consider putting in the requirement for the Quality Assurance inspections, then AWS takes care of this directly themselves in their reviews. William C. Pegues, FCSI, CCS, SCIP Affiliate WDG Architecture, Washington, DC | Dallas, TX Richard L Matteo, AIA, CSI, CCS Senior Member Username: rlmat Post Number: 439 Registered: 10-2003 Posted on Friday, August 12, 2011 - 01:35 pm:    Robin, I agree with William regarding stapling and I would follow Brad's recommendations. If the Project is in either So. Cal, Arizona or So. Nevada I would reference WI Certified Compliance or Monitored Compliance. I would confirm this with Brad as he would probably be doing the inspections If you have additional questions you can conact me at richard.matteo@stvinc.com or 213.219.3605 Richard L. Matteo, AIA, CSI, CCS STV Incorporated Los Angeles, CA I am also on the Board of Directors for the Woodwork Institute Bradley Roa, Director of Architectural Services Intermediate Member Username: bradley_roa Post Number: 4 Registered: 08-2010 Posted on Friday, August 12, 2011 - 02:11 pm:    William's advice is well taken. Section 10, Paragraph 4.4.20.4.2 describes MECHANICAL FASTENERS for cabinet BODY as: At EXPOSED SURFACES, staples, screws, or T-nails are not permitted. Also Paragraph 4.4.1.9 describes how filler may and may not be used. It is NOT ALLOWED for Premium grade. (so you could not fill a staple hole anyhow)