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Gerard Sanchis
Senior Member
Username: gerard_sanchis

Post Number: 16
Registered: 10-2009

Posted on Sunday, April 17, 2011 - 09:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

I use one or a combination of the following for my research when writing a section. What other sites or sources of information do you rely upon?

Blue Book.
Manufacturers’ Catalogs.
Manufacturers’ websites.
Seminars, conventions and Webminars.
Doug Frank FCSI, CCS
Senior Member
Username: doug_frank_ccs

Post Number: 281
Registered: 06-2002

Posted on Monday, April 18, 2011 - 07:37 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Gerard, I'd add the following:
4specs forums
Manufacturer’s Reps
Doug Frank FCSI, CCS, SCIP Affiliate
FKP Architects, Inc.
Houston, TX
Lynn Javoroski CSI CCS LEED® AP SCIP Affiliate
Senior Member
Username: lynn_javoroski

Post Number: 1233
Registered: 07-2002

Posted on Monday, April 18, 2011 - 10:04 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Gerard, I do not use Arcat, and rarely use sweets; but I do occasionally use Google...when nothing else has worked.
Anne Whitacre, FCSI CCS
Senior Member
Username: awhitacre

Post Number: 1144
Registered: 07-2002

Posted on Monday, April 18, 2011 - 01:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Arcat? Sweets? Blue Book? what century is this?

seriously -- I use manufacturer's web sites and that's about it. Sometimes 4specs to find a manufacturer, but most of the time get information through colleagues and my email lists.
Dale Hurttgam, NCARB, AIA,LEED AP, CSI
Senior Member
Username: dwhurttgam

Post Number: 84
Registered: 10-2005
Posted on Monday, April 18, 2011 - 02:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

I usually go right to manufacturer websites via google or just do broad search on google if I am starting from scratch. Find it amazing sometimes that you can put in the full question of what you are looking for into a google search and it will lead you right to what you are looking for - do not need to be concerned with brevity. The two other most frequent resources are MasterSpec support docs and 4Specs discussion forum. The other resource is a handfull of trusted product reps when a very unique concern arises.
Phil Kabza
Senior Member
Username: phil_kabza

Post Number: 473
Registered: 12-2002

Posted on Monday, April 18, 2011 - 09:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

As for Gerard's initial question, I would add to the above:

UFGS: They're not always the best specs, but sometimes you'll find experience items in various Federal specs that you might want to incorporate

WBDG.org: The Whole Building Design Guide is becoming a very valuable general reference for design

Information Aggregator Site Guide Specs: Not. Their idea of what constitutes a useful spec is usually a long ways from what I need.

Conventions: Not so much. It's an incredibly inefficient means of information transfer. Seminar content is spotty. We attend for the networking and socializing.
J. Peter Jordan (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted on Tuesday, April 19, 2011 - 10:08 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

MasterSpec support docs, 4specs (as an index), and manufacturer's websites (found by my browser's search engine or through 4specs),

Two sites I use on almost every project are: (1) Oldcastle's GlasSelect web site (others have similar information, but for basic configurations not tied to a single glass manufacturer, this site is intuitive and fast); and (2) The MPI website for basic paint information and systems.

I also have some Texas-specific websites bookmarked (wind storm and accessibility as well as law on public building procurement).

I would add manuals from trade associations (1) TCNA's handbook for tile installation; even with good masters, I often refer to this document. I like the hardcopy, but I also now have a searchable electronic copy which is terribly useful; and (2) AWI's woodwork standards manual is also very useful.

Nothing replaces a "golden rep" who knows his/her stuff (and what stuff others make) and who will even return weekend phone calls.

I would respectfully disagree somewhat with Phil about the value of conventions for "rookies" as opposed to ol' dogs. I would go for the networking and socializing, but I would take a spec intern and make them go to as many seminars as possible.
Marc C Chavez
Senior Member
Username: mchavez

Post Number: 410
Registered: 07-2002

Posted on Tuesday, April 19, 2011 - 11:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

a good therapist
a good bartender (or see above)
a friend who is even geekey-er, so we look normal
Steven Bruneel, AIA, CSI-CDT, LEED-AP
Senior Member
Username: redseca2

Post Number: 270
Registered: 12-2006

Posted on Tuesday, April 19, 2011 - 01:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Skipping stuff in my computer drives or on the internet, where 98% of what I need is, these are the totally unscientific, no rhyme or reason but they are useful, hardcopies that live on my desk taking up about 4 feet of space:

A 1973 Scientific American, still with my mailing label at college, featuring an early technical article about CAD to really freak out the kids. If that isn't enough, I show them the slide rule.

A set of Jakob Inox catalogs for cable structures, because it is usually left to me to figure this stuff out.

Julius Blum, ditto.

Hafele, ditto.

Simpson Strong-Tie Catalog; I don't know, we never do wood in this office. It must be an icon of my youth.

A whole bunch of stuff about planning and specifying Labyrinths because it is intersting and I have no idea where else to file it.

A stack of copies of steel shape catalogs from US steel that I hand out so designers don't need to swipe the entire steel manual from the library just to get a dimension.

AWS Manual (the merging of WI(C) and AWI.

Thick catalogs of firestopping systems with UL assemblies from some of the major manufacturers.

Brochures for fire rated glass types with all approval info.

Copies of AAMA standards for aluminum finishes and lab and field testing procedures for glazing systems.

Indiana Limestone Handbook.

ANSI for Tile.

A stack of copies of the TCNA Tile handbook that I hand out to designers so that there might be some similarity between their drawings and my spec.

Several paint rep crib sheets for low VOC paints and general comparison charts showing equals across the paint brands we specify. Also a bunch of similar spreadsheet application charts for various industrial coatings and other mysterious products you spray on things.

MPI Manual, which I use to hold up the paint crib sheets.

Old, falling apart MasterFormat 1995 book.

MasterFormat 2004, one for me, and extras that I hand out when I feel optimistic about the future.

"Green Guide for Healthcare" Handbook, ARCOM "Specifying LEED" Handbook and out of date LEED 2.2 Manual.

CSI Western Region Directory.

"Unabomber's Manifesto"; I really don't remember why I have this, but it is one of the most frequently requested things I keep handy. I keep it with the other sustainable design stuff.

AIA SF Directory

Printed off the web menus for some of the walking distance restaurants I keep in business.
Sheldon Wolfe
Senior Member
Username: sheldon_wolfe

Post Number: 479
Registered: 01-2003

Posted on Tuesday, April 19, 2011 - 04:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Steven, we have much the same library. A few more:

An 8-inch floppy to really scare the kids
Graphic Standards, third edition
Specification Record, Volumes III and IV
Jinx's AOP Manual
Charlie Shrive's "Applying CSI Principles to Mechanical and Electrical Specifications"
Assorted cross-reference tables for equivalent products by different manufacturers
ASTM Standards in Building Codes (need an update)
Uniform Location of Subject Matter
My "toy box" full of small samples
A few choice Far Side cartoons for perspective
Seating chart for Target Field

Absent: Sweet's, ARCAT, First Source
Lynn Javoroski CSI CCS LEED® AP SCIP Affiliate
Senior Member
Username: lynn_javoroski

Post Number: 1234
Registered: 07-2002

Posted on Tuesday, April 19, 2011 - 04:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Ah, now we're getting esoteric: I add the "Unistrut General Engineering Catalog" pocket edition; "State of Wisconsin DOT Standard Specifications for Highway and Structure Construction" 1996 edition; "Construction of Architecture from Design to Built", R. Liebing; and "Architects' Specifications - How to Write Them" AIA, 1948. Oh yeah, and "Self-Care for a Headache in Progress"...
Wayne Yancey
Senior Member
Username: wayne_yancey

Post Number: 446
Registered: 01-2008

Posted on Tuesday, April 19, 2011 - 05:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Most of the references noted above plus

Contrator's Guide to Change Orders

Incompatible Building Materials by CMHC

An Alphabetized Word List of Definitions, Defined Terms, and a Glossary (Construction Contract Front End and Contract Admin Terms

Rain Penetration Control / Applying Current Knowledge


2011 TCNA Handbook (includes Canadian TTMAC)

AWS, 1ST Edition (WI, AWI, AWMAC)

Architectural Quality Control, An Illustreated Guide by Fred Nashed (valuable resourse)

Uniformat II

Materials, Structures, Standards by Julia McMorrough (All the details architects need to know but cannot find)

Copper and Common Sense by Revere Copper Products, Inc.

Illustrated 2006 Building Code Handbook

I miss the evaluations bundled with MasterSpec.
Phil Kabza
Senior Member
Username: phil_kabza

Post Number: 474
Registered: 12-2002

Posted on Tuesday, April 19, 2011 - 05:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Ok: seeing the always-gentlemanly J. Peter has respectfully disagreed with me above, I'll modify my negative comment about convention seminars by agreeing that they can be a stimulus to learning for some attendees, especially young practitioners. However, as a source of useful reference information, they almost always fall short. And that's the good presentations, not the ones where ... well, you know.

Sitting in a dark room elbow to elbow with a hundred other people, unable to take meaningful notes, doesn't provide referenceable information. Just take a test 60 days later on the content of the 5 or 6 seminars you attended. How many can you even name? Can you find the presenters' websites? Can you locate the handouts or the CD you brought back? Do you have time to look? While you may have walked out of the door commenting on how useful that seminar was, does the information actually change how you practice starting the week you're back in the office? Seldom happens.

Most of the information we need in order to select products and write specifications and contribute to design and construction processes is useless to us ... until we need it. For the same reason, I decline to see visiting product reps who want to "update me on their products." I don't want their information - until I need it. So I make sure I know how to contact our rep friends when that time comes, and then turn back to the keyboard to get some billable work done.
Sheldon Wolfe
Senior Member
Username: sheldon_wolfe

Post Number: 480
Registered: 01-2003

Posted on Tuesday, April 19, 2011 - 10:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

When it comes to conventions, where you are in your career definitely makes a difference. I remember the first one I went to, Chicago in '90; I was like a kid in a candy store. I had been a specifier for only a few years, and I couldn't get enough information. It was hard to choose seminars, as it seemed there were always at least two I wanted to attend at the same time.

Twenty years later, I sometimes find it difficult to find a seminar for every time period. The problem is that there is always someone new, so those introductory seminars must be repeated every year.

The exhibit floor is different. I always find something new, and I never have enough time to cover the floor. Back to my first convention, I didn't realize that the companies would mail the information to you, and my bag was dragging by the time I got to the end of the first aisle.

Otherwise, I can't disagree with Phil. Although I may find a seminar interesting, I rarely walk away thinking, "I can't wait to get back and put that to use." It's not that the information is necessarily bad or useless, it just isn't useful at that moment, and it's not there when you decide you need it.

Although I get information online every day, because it's a great way to quickly access many sources for just about any subject, when it's crunch time I go to my reps.
Steven Bruneel, AIA, CSI-CDT, LEED-AP
Senior Member
Username: redseca2

Post Number: 271
Registered: 12-2006

Posted on Wednesday, April 20, 2011 - 12:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

I avoid the conventions, except for one, the Monterey Design Conference, at Asilomar (designed by Julia Morgan) on the cusp of Pacific Grove and Monterey in September tending towards October every other year put on by Cali AIA.

Not much tech info new and useful for a spec writer but a lot of inspiration for architects, with all night opportunities for networking on the beach.

Then, bright and early, you get religion, as passed down to spec writers by the likes of Snoghatta Architects, from Oslo, Norway (hi Knut!), and spec writers ride home on their motorcycles with a bee in their bonnet to do better next time (after stopping in San Juan Batista for a decent meal.
John Regener, AIA, CCS, CCCA, CSI, SCIP
Senior Member
Username: john_regener

Post Number: 524
Registered: 04-2002

Posted on Wednesday, April 20, 2011 - 11:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

How about some resources for how to rite spex real goodly, like the CSI Project Resource Manual/Manual of Practice ... and maybe the "Rosen" book? Even read Herman Hoyer's commentary on shortform specs (posted on 4specs and, with editing, included with Herman's approval in the "Rosen" book). Oh, and those conjoined documents from CSI: SectionFormat/PageFormat.

Some additional general resources:

- ICC Evaluation Reports: very valuable information.

- Manufacturer's "guide specs" and "master specs", which can be useful after the marketing crap, disorganization, poor specification writing language and incompleteness are corrected.

- Manufacturer's websites with spec-generating programs (see above for criticism but some are very good such as Armstrong's).

- ARCAT's SpecWizard (need lots less modification generally than specs from manufacturer's websites).

- Reed Construction Data, building product information that includes (infrequently) some Spec-Data and Manu-Spec documents.

- Your network of spec writing colleagues, who have that obscure spec written 11 years ago on the subject you've never had to address until now and the spec is due at noon tomorrow. It's a big help for getting started on the section.
Chris Grimm, CSI, CCS, SCIP Affiliate, LEED-AP, MAI, RLA
Senior Member
Username: tsugaguy

Post Number: 255
Registered: 06-2005

Posted on Thursday, April 21, 2011 - 12:00 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

add BIA tech notes for masonry,

SpecAgent (why not, it is right next to what you are working on, if you are a MasterSpec user, and haven't minimized it),

and #1, get clarification from the project architect (or other design professional). Often when presented with the choices (from any of the master document sources and manufacturer data previously mentioned) you may find that the designer will know what they want....it's just a matter of knowing what questions to ask. In time, you may become a mind reader to some extent, suggesting likely answers (assumptions) based on project types, designer preferences, and repeat client preferences.

A good book an architectural metals, like Zahner, is helpful. And NRCA for roofing, and SMACNA for sheet metal flashings, etc. BHMA for door hardware. For many topics there will be one or more trade organizations that have devloped standards. Arcom's Suporting Documents do a great job at compiling these into a list with each spec section.

Specialty consultants for roofing, hardware, and an assortment of other topics would be highly recommended.

Many other good sources have already been mentioned that I won't restate.

It can also be helpful to look at (not copy) past specs from similar projects. But be aware that reference standards, lists of manufacturers and product names, technolgies, and code requirements may have changed sigificantly - and of course the new project will likely require many items that were deleted from the old project. That method is mainly useful for clients who don't have design standards and your firm has done past work for them or for similar projects. But a good guide spec like MasterSpec, with the supporting documents (yes they are still available), coupled with office master defaults for deletions and customizations, would be tough to beat as a top reference source. Using the right tools (LINX or e-SPECS) you can quickly whittle a section down a lot, either as a starting point for an office master, or for a project spec.

The real source of information we need, ultimately, is from the manufacturers. Unfortunately they don't have a very consistent way of presenting the information, even with the 3-part CSI SectionFormat. And it is hard to trust at face value the information you receive. Some want to gain an unfair advantage in a tough bidding market.

CSI can be very helpful for networking, and sometimes even product reps who want to see you when you don't need them (but you must learn how much time is worthwhile to get contact info and know what they can offer) -- so you know who to call when you need a quick answer on a variety of technical topics. While meeting with those who don't already have the inside scoop, you can also tell them about the next CSI events in your chapter or region. If they decide to get inovlved, they will find out like others who already know, how to be the resource the local specifiers and designers will look to, rather than relying only on cold-calling.
Dale Hurttgam, NCARB, AIA,LEED AP, CSI
Senior Member
Username: dwhurttgam

Post Number: 85
Registered: 10-2005
Posted on Thursday, April 21, 2011 - 10:28 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Had an amazing experience with a "Manufacturer Rep" yesterday.

The Project Architect had a unique product application, but had not contacted the manufacturer rep in regards to the application. Product usually used in interior applications being used on the exterior - potentially with some exposure to ice and snow.

I contacted our local rep who indicated some adjustments to the model and material that the architect had initially selected - but still from the same basic product line. He noted that he would send some color samples because the appropirate "exterior" product was available in only a limited number of colors.

I had hardly been off the phone with the rep (perhaps a half hour at best), and our receptionist called that a package had been dropped off at her desk for me.

It was a package from the rep that I had just spoken to with color samples for the exterior product line, a "submittal" print out for the applicable product and a couple of supporting product brochures.

We were quite amazed at the quickness of the response. In a comment above, I had noted that my resources included a "handful of trusted product reps". Although this rep was already in my "product rep business card resource", this rep has just been added to that group of "trusted reps" that I call on in a pinch.

I emailed him to let him know that his response was appreciated - and how amazed we were at how quick it was.

Although we sometimes complain about manufacturer resources, it is good to let them know that good and many times outstanding assistance is appreciated.
J. Peter Jordan (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted on Thursday, April 21, 2011 - 10:59 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

I wish manufacturers knew how we felt. I sometimes think that products "fail" in certain regions of the country for reasons that have nothing to do with the product itself.

The manufacturer's rep interprets the products to potential specifiers and users. Shoddy or indifferent representation can leave a very poor impression. Other factors include adequate distribution and a base of skilled installers.

You can see this sometimes on this forum where people in one part of the country are very positive about a product line while those in another part of the country (with a different product rep) have a very poor impression of the product.
Gerard Sanchis
Senior Member
Username: gerard_sanchis

Post Number: 19
Registered: 10-2009

Posted on Sunday, April 24, 2011 - 02:00 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Thank you all. Some of the answers are very useful. I even learned of a few sites that I did not know existed, as you may have also. The question was posed because Jerry Orland and I intend to offer a class on spec writing for the L.A. chapter.

Most project architects who do not have access to an in-house specifier or a consultant, have to write a section from scratch from time to time, we intend to show those brave souls, foolish enough to spend their Saturdays with us, how to put together some very simple sections using information available to all; thus my question.

We have no intention to teach about formats, writing styles, and other basic stuff. One of the prerequisite to participate is that the attendees be somewhat familiar with the basic tools required to produce a section.

If anyone has useful advice to offer on the subject, we’d like to hear from you.
Chris Grimm, CSI, CCS, SCIP Affiliate, LEED-AP, MAI, RLA
Senior Member
Username: tsugaguy

Post Number: 256
Registered: 06-2005

Posted on Monday, May 02, 2011 - 09:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post


A couple years ago our CSI chapter presented a program on specification writing. It was our first time at it, and I made notes afterward of areas we might explore or improve the next time around. We designed the program to correlate with the NCARB IDP requirements for specs, thinking that some interns would find it an interesting opportunity. Well we were wrong about "some." There were many, and they filled the room. It may be difficult for young architects to find the opportunities to satisfy those requirements, and our class helped to fill that void. We had hands-on excercises so the attendees could work with some sections while having three of us mentor/instructors available when they had questions. In hindsight I would make the exercises correspond more closely with the exercises in the IDP program, and look into student licensing for some sample master sections of various types. It sounds like you maybe are targeting a bit more experienced architects though so not sure if that's what you had in mind.
David Stutzman
Senior Member
Username: david_stutzman

Post Number: 70
Registered: 07-2002
Posted on Tuesday, May 03, 2011 - 07:51 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Chris, very interesting comments about the IDP. Do you have more information on your chapter's program? This may be something that I would like to consider for Philly.
Chris Grimm, CSI, CCS, SCIP Affiliate, LEED-AP, MAI, RLA
Senior Member
Username: tsugaguy

Post Number: 257
Registered: 06-2005

Posted on Tuesday, May 03, 2011 - 08:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

These are the links I had to the NCARB IDP requirements for specifications, can't tell for sure on my phone but perhaps neither of them work now?



Somewhere I have an agenda, will try to send it to you David.
Lynn Javoroski CSI CCS LEED® AP SCIP Affiliate
Senior Member
Username: lynn_javoroski

Post Number: 1246
Registered: 07-2002

Posted on Tuesday, May 03, 2011 - 09:38 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Chris, would you also send the agenda to me?

Senior Member
Username: wbevier

Post Number: 28
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Tuesday, May 03, 2011 - 09:43 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Chris, I tried both links and they are no longer working. If you have any updated materials related to the IDP specifications requirements I would like to be included in your post. Thanks
Jim Sliff
Senior Member
Username: jim_sliff

Post Number: 50
Registered: 08-2010

Posted on Tuesday, May 03, 2011 - 07:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

"when it's crunch time I go to my reps."

Ditto. And I've been on the internet since it consisted of interconnected dialup bulletin boards with something called "electronic mail" we could send to *another* board!

Hang on - my wife's having trouble with the Model T crank...

Anyway - 95% of the time I can find what I need on the 'net (it's really in knowing how to use the various search engines - which most computer users, sadly, don't). When I'm stumped - or if something smells bad, or if the scope is REALLY weird (which is kinda my specialty anyway) I call a rep.

But IMO it's important to note what J. Peter said about regional differences and reps. Since I spent about 15 years at least partially on that side o' the fence, I can state in all confidence that there are *great* are *horrendous* reps with most of the larger companies.

Nowadays I have no time for sit-down office meetings (I'd have to move my guitars anyway) where I'd get the same info I could get through email or phone. So I try to find or be referred to *the* go-to guy or gal at each company. I don't care if they're in Kansas (I'm in L.A.) - the "go-to" person will understand regional differences/requirements.

One thing that makes me respect a rep...probably THE biggest thing...is when they say "dang - I have no idea if that will work or not - but I will contact the folks that do and get back to you by "x:xx" and DOES. That rep is invaluable, and I couldn't care less if they can't tell a catalyst from a retard...er.

"Doers" - ones that try their hardest, but sometimes fail - are a dime a dozen. "Getter-done-ers" - those that may not know squat but ALWAYS find the answer in time are a rare breed.
Helaine K. Robinson CSI CCS CCCA SCIP
Senior Member
Username: hollyrob

Post Number: 375
Registered: 07-2003
Posted on Wednesday, May 04, 2011 - 06:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Chris - I would like to see this also.
David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI
Senior Member
Username: david_axt

Post Number: 1181
Registered: 03-2002

Posted on Thursday, May 05, 2011 - 01:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

I recommend the "The Gypsum construction Handbook (6th Edition)" by USG. You can view this book online or purchase a hard copy. http://www.usg.com/index.html

I had to buy my own book because the USG rep would not give me one. It is worth the $40 I spent.
J. Peter Jordan (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted on Thursday, May 05, 2011 - 02:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

OK, David; there you have a perfect example of the oposite of a "golden rep"; a "lead rep" (rhymes with "dead rep").

I would start specifying a lot of GP and National Gypsum products.
David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI
Senior Member
Username: david_axt

Post Number: 1182
Registered: 03-2002

Posted on Thursday, May 05, 2011 - 05:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Another good resource that you can get for FREE is Armstrong's "Guaranteed Installation Systems (F-5061)" and "General Maintenance Recommendations (F-8663)".


Or online copy:

Jim Sliff
Senior Member
Username: jim_sliff

Post Number: 56
Registered: 08-2010

Posted on Friday, May 20, 2011 - 04:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

The USG example reminded me of one other thing -

I haven't requested a catalog in several years. The USG "book" is a perfect example of what I prefer - it's a set of PDF files. I keep a downloaded set in my "library" - which resides on a cloud drive (actually several - I'm better organized with different categories of documents on different cloud systems, but that's just me).

Every important piece of catalog information is with me at all times via my laptop, iPad or iPhone.

If I get a catalog in the mail unsolicited it hits the recycle bin (if it's something I DO need I'll bookmark their website).

If a company does not have critical documents on electronic media by now they are WAY behind the times. Granted, many electronic guide specs are poorly done, but they're just as bad in print form and catalogs take up space.

My actual "catalog" library is down to a couple of 3' shelves - and I could probably pitch half those and never miss 'em.

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