OSHKOSH Architectural Door Company

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Author Message Karen Aldrich New member Username: kaldr Post Number: 1 Registered: 06-2006 Posted on Tuesday, June 20, 2006 - 01:51 pm:    Does anyone have experience with OSHKOSH Architectural Door Company? I am considering including them in our company master specification for wood doors. Our buidling project mix is about 50% health care, 40% commercial/interior bulid-out and 10% airport. Richard Howard, AIA CSI CCS Senior Member Username: rick_howard Post Number: 83 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Tuesday, June 20, 2006 - 02:07 pm:    We have done projects with them. They are very responsive and their products are top quality. Harold S. Woolard Senior Member Username: harold_woolard Post Number: 28 Registered: 12-2003 Posted on Saturday, June 24, 2006 - 07:57 pm:    I'm glad that OSHKOSH has quality products. But from a Industry member, I have a question. Does OSHKOCH support local CSI chapters and Regions, along with Institute conventions. If not then I'd look to some companies that do support CSI and has quality products also. George A. Everding, AIA, CSI, CCS, CCCA Senior Member Username: geverding Post Number: 180 Registered: 11-2004 Posted on Monday, June 26, 2006 - 01:26 pm:    An interesting and totally unscientific test to gauge a company's support for CSI, use the member directory search on csinet and enter the company name. See how many, or how few, results you get. Out of curiousity, I tried that for Certainteed when the "Certainteed email" discussion thread was going strong a few weeks ago. For comparison try "HILTI" and "YKK"; to name a couple of companies that do support CSI. Just another internet amusement for the jaded specwriter. Brett M. Wilbur CSI, CCS, AIA Senior Member Username: brett Post Number: 122 Registered: 12-2004 Posted on Monday, June 26, 2006 - 01:48 pm:    Just becasue they may be CSI members doesn't mean they attend, support or participate. I have met many vendors/reps who have CSI listed on their business card, but wehn I ask them if they willl be at the monthly meeting, they act like they didn't even know we had them. I don't think that should be the only reason we use certain products though. Quality, past history, timeliness and service are among the top reaasons I pick manufacturers. As far as wood and plastic laminated faced doors, we specify the following: a. Buell Door Co. b. Eggers Industries c. Ideal Architectural Door & Plywood d. Marshfield Doors Systems, Inc. e. Oshkosh Architectural Door Company f. VT Industries, Inc. They are all of comparable quality. Marshfield is very service oriented locally, which I like. They are my go-to guys. Anonymous   Posted on Monday, June 26, 2006 - 01:47 pm:    I hope sombody can explain the correlation between a quality manufacturer/product being included in an office master and if they "support local CSI chapters and regions along with Institute conventions." I belong to the Phila. Chapter and I would be willing to say that most of our industry members are independant reps. They are extremely active and supportive of CSI as individuals. The manufacturers they rep may or may not be supportive in the same way that you are referring to. How should all of this factor into my product selection? Phil Kabza Senior Member Username: phil_kabza Post Number: 185 Registered: 12-2002 Posted on Monday, June 26, 2006 - 10:22 pm:    CSI involvement by manufacturers should and shouldn't factor in. We should specify what is best for our clients. However, it is natural for those of us who are involved with CSI to make an extra effort in relationship to manufacturers who support CSI. It's also natural to make an extra effort for those manufacturers who invest in keeping an architectural representative in our regions. Ultimately, this is because we know that their specification input will likely be more valuable, and that an owner's problems are more likely to be resolved if there are people we know that we can turn to for assistance. George A. Everding, AIA, CSI, CCS, CCCA Senior Member Username: geverding Post Number: 181 Registered: 11-2004 Posted on Tuesday, June 27, 2006 - 09:52 am:    Well said, Mr. Kabza and Mr. Wilbur. You don’t select a product solely because you know and trust the representative; you select based on which product is best for the project. But keep in mind that we specifiers see and talk to hundreds of product representatives in the course of a year. What CSI membership (and better, CSI involvement, and even better certification) does for an unknown product rep is that it gives him or her instant credibility at the first meeting with us. A rep without credentials has to win my trust first; a CDT or CCPR starts out with my trust. And I think the same thing is true with evaluating an unknown manufacturer. Support of CSI is one of the plus factors, but not the only one. Back to the original question, wood doors are almost a commodity product; you specify a quality standard like AWI or WDMA, define a species, cut, match, finish, etc. Our firm still insists on 5-ply bonded, so I list Algoma, Buell, Eggers, Ideal, Oshkosh, and VT, since they only offer 5-ply for flush wood. I would only drop a manufacturer from the list if we'd had problems on a job, and I haven’t heard of any from the above listed companies. Lynn Javoroski CSI CCS LEED AP SCIP Affiliate Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 393 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Tuesday, June 27, 2006 - 02:13 pm:    A couple of years ago, my company had a problem with stain color on doors provided by VT - they didn't come close to matching the sample. After a little go-around, VT made good on the doors (and fixed the internal cause of the problem) and we haven't had any trouble since. And that's why you spec the quality standards, request samples, and work with a reputable company. Because problems will occur; it's what happens after they do. Brett M. Wilbur CSI, CCS, AIA Senior Member Username: brett Post Number: 124 Registered: 12-2004 Posted on Tuesday, June 27, 2006 - 02:25 pm:    Lynn, nicely put. Steve Talanian Senior Member Username: stalanian Post Number: 11 Registered: 11-2005 Posted on Tuesday, June 27, 2006 - 03:32 pm:    All of the companies mentioned by George and Brett are large manufacturers with a relatively long history. Specifying the standards and defining the door details are all very important as George mentioned; and how a company reacts when there's "a problem" is extremely important; but, none of those companies sell direct to contractors. They all sell through distribution...which is good because it creates a market place. If possible, you need to set some sort of standard regarding where the doors are being purchased. There are plenty of "new" companies that are distributors of these wood door companies that really are not familiar with specifications or how to order wood doors. You should require some type of standard with regard to the distributor as to how long the company has experience in ordering and working with the specified wood door product and require the distributor to be a UL or WHI factory approved modification shop. If they are UL or WHI approved they already have the knowledge and experience with regard to wood door construction and modifictaion. If the distributor is a "fly-by-night" company that totally messed up the wood door order then they probably will not be there to "fix" any problem. If such a thing where to happen the factory will be contacted and they're going to do nothing (for free) if the distributor made mistakes with the order. But, if the distributor did everything right and there a reputable company they will be there to facilitate any warranty issue and work with the contractor, architect, end user and the factory. As long as the distributor did everything right then the factory will stand behind the product whether the distributor exists any more or not. Chris Grimm, CSI, CCS, MAI, RLA Senior Member Username: tsugaguy Post Number: 68 Registered: 06-2005 Posted on Friday, March 23, 2007 - 09:08 am:    In addition to those manufacturers Brett and George mentioned, our firm has also listed GRAHAM, Lambton, and Mohawk. From their websites, all 3 appear to also offer 5-ply bonded: http://www.grahamdoors.com/doors/gpd-main-5.htm http://www.lambtondoors.com/frame3.html http://www.mohawkdoors.com/2006SpecPDF/Mohawk2006Commercial.PDF Has anyone had negative field experiences or found their door construction methods unsuitable for some other reason, and decided not to include 1 or more of these manufacturers? David R. Combs, CSI, CCS, CCCA Senior Member Username: davidcombs Post Number: 213 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Friday, March 23, 2007 - 12:18 pm:    Just an update to the door manufacturers list: Buell Door went out of business last summer. Dale Hurttgam, NCARB, AIA,LEED AP, CSI Senior Member Username: dwhurttgam Post Number: 22 Registered: 10-2005 Posted on Friday, March 23, 2007 - 12:46 pm:    This is on the Buell Website - their phone numbers are not operational. Is the company continuing operation under a different name? Any information? BUELL DOOR CLOSES ITS "DOORS" (Dallas , TX , July 11, 2006) — Dearest Buell Door, Buell Flooring, Buell Sales and Service, Total Opening Systems, and Unique Moulding Customers, It is with a heavy heart that Buell communicates to you that Buell Door Company and all subsidiaries will not be operational after 5:00 p.m. on Tuesday, July 11, 2006. A receiver has been appointed for control of the company and will answer all questions, calls, and concerns after this time. We appreciate your continued support of Buell Door Company through the past years and decades and will miss seeing Buell Door Company products in buildings across the country. Return to Buell News Archive Helaine K. (Holly) Robinson CSI CCS CCCA Senior Member Username: hollyrob Post Number: 305 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Friday, March 23, 2007 - 12:50 pm:    http://www.4specs.com/s/changes/changes_2006.html Buell Door, Buell Flooring, and Unique Moulding - Buell Door Company and all subsidiaries will not be operational after July 11, 2006. Niki Koplowitz Senior Member Username: nikitk Post Number: 12 Registered: 06-2005 Posted on Friday, March 23, 2007 - 12:53 pm:    No, Buell folded. There was an auction for all assets last fall. Alas, it was in Texas, and I am...not.