Dampproofing

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Author Message David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 546 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Monday, September 19, 2005 - 08:07 pm:    Has anybody specified dampproofing? What are some good products? This product will be used inside of planters and will not be under occupied spaces. Richard L Matteo, AIA, CSI, CCS Senior Member Username: rlmat Post Number: 115 Registered: 10-2003 Posted on Monday, September 19, 2005 - 08:28 pm:    We also specifiy it for inside of planters. Since planters will not be, I think you meant over, occupied spaces I would suggest following: Cold-Applied, Emulsified-Asphalt Dampproofing: Euclid Chemical Company Henry Company Karnak Corporation Koppers Industries, Inc. Malarkey Roofing Company Meadows, W. R., Inc. Tamms Industries. If you ever need to do planter waterproofing over occupied spaces my choice would be American Hydotech or equivalent by Henry's or Carlisle. Steven T. Lawrey, AIA, CSI, CCS, CCCA Senior Member Username: lawrey Post Number: 32 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Wednesday, September 21, 2005 - 02:19 pm:    Richard makes a good point about waterproofing over occupied spaces. To use damproofing is ineffective and a waste of the owner's money. David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 549 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Wednesday, September 21, 2005 - 02:24 pm:    The reason why I am asking the question is that I never have specified dampproofing. In fact I was surprised that it even existed anymore. Do you guys have any favorite products? William C. Pegues, FCSI, CCS Senior Member Username: wpegues Post Number: 493 Registered: 10-2002 Posted on Wednesday, September 21, 2005 - 02:30 pm:    David, You see it a lot in residential applications (houses, townhouses, etc.) But also, it is a good application for coating the shaft side of garage exhaust shafts. It needs to be UV resistant for that, not all products are. Its not waterproofing. I actually use a waterproofing membrane in planters whether over occupied space or not. Someone could make a mistake and over water significantly and the dampproofing will likely let some moisture through. Its not going to damage occupied space, but the water might damage the outside finish of the planter construction, or do unseen damage if it the saturated wall is behind a cladding of some kind - even on vertical walls. Harold S. Woolard Senior Member Username: harold_woolard Post Number: 19 Registered: 12-2003 Posted on Wednesday, September 21, 2005 - 03:15 pm:    I've sold dampproofing products for 29 years, and they are still alive. There are 2 different types of dampproofing products with each type having 3 grades. Each of these 6 products have a ASTM number associated with them. The first type is solvent-type which has the 3 grades first being a Spray-mastic, next a Semi-Mastic, and then Trowel-Matic. These products are used for reducing dampness and moisture infiltration through foundation walls, parapets, fire walls, tanks, culverts, and bridge abutments. They are also applicable for stone-backing,above grade cavity wall applications and below-grade masonry wall dampproofing. These dampproofing product line helps to minimize internal structural damage from mildew anc mold. The second type is the Emulsion type of dampproofing products with Type I being a spray grade, Type II, is called brush on or spray grade, and finally Type III is trowel-on grade. These products are the VOC compliant as are the Solvent Type just a lower VOC number. Anyway I would NOT recommend using a dampproofing product for a planter application. In 5 years the dampproofing product will start to leak and stain the outside of the concrete wall. I would recommend either a peel and stick or a liquid membrane with a asphaltic protection course used to protect either. You can call 1-800-342-5976 for a local representive that can help you specify the correct product for your needs. David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 550 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Wednesday, September 21, 2005 - 08:08 pm:    Harold, Thanks for the education. As I said before. I know nothing about dampproofing because I don't specify it. I specify waterproofing. Heck for the same price (or pennies more) plus the same amount of labor you can have a better product with waterproofing. Unfortunately I am working with a "Mr. Know-It-All" architect who insists that I specify dampproofing for the planters. Richard L Matteo, AIA, CSI, CCS Senior Member Username: rlmat Post Number: 116 Registered: 10-2003 Posted on Wednesday, September 21, 2005 - 08:33 pm:    Another product is Procor by W.R. Grace It's sprayed on and a lot easier to apply than "Peel & Stick". I never really specified dampproofing too much until I came out to California. Some of the staff in my office here seem to think it's much cheaper (excuse me, less expensive)than waterproofing. I personally agree with you David on the difference in cost vs performance. I also agree that the planters should be waterproofed and not dampproofed regardless of their location. We always did in my office in Connecticut, regardless of where the planters were located. However, I had a "know-it-all" client back East that wouldn't pay for waterproofing on a below grade parking level under his building. So we just dampproofed it. I told the PA to tell him that if his Mercedes got wet don't call us! Don Harris CSI, CCS, CCCA, AIA Senior Member Username: don_harris Post Number: 44 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Thursday, September 22, 2005 - 08:45 am:    There seems to be a misunderstanding of the difference between dampproofing and waterproofing. Dampproofing is for water not under hydrostatic pressure. Therefore, I believe that products like Procor or the peel and stick products could be considered overkill if dampproofing is what is actually needed. We typically specify dampproofing on the outside face of CMU backup in masonry cavity-wall construction. Now that air barriers are becoming more common, we are rethinking this use on a job to job basis. Wayne Yancey Senior Member Username: wyancey Post Number: 71 Registered: 05-2005 Posted on Thursday, September 22, 2005 - 12:11 pm:    David, Inside planters over conditioned space or over parking garages or unheated storage, we prefer products that are premanufactured to provide consistent mil thickness. If your planters are placed on slab on grade, damproofing with protection course would be OK. Nothing like a water leak dripping on my Porche. Wayne Anne Whitacre, CCS CSI Senior Member Username: awhitacre Post Number: 245 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Thursday, September 22, 2005 - 01:57 pm:    David - is this the same know-it-all architect you've spoken of before? why not let him just write his own specs, and once he gets in the field, he'll find out how much he knows.... Anne Ellis C. Whitby, AIA, PE, CSI Advanced Member Username: ecwhitby Post Number: 6 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 10:42 am:    Does anyone have any experience with "Watchdog Waterproofing’s” sprayed on “polymer-enhanced asphalt liquid-applied” membrane? The GC is proposing this as a substitution for above grade applications in cavitywall construction (on CMU), in lieu of the specified fibered emulsion mastic (ASTM D-1227, Type II, Class I). The reason is that toweling on a mastic dampproofing between the brick ties will “lend itself to cavities” or gaps in the dampproofing. David R. Combs, CSI, CCS, CCCA, MAI Senior Member Username: davidcombs Post Number: 78 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 01:46 pm:    Can they not use the spray-applied version instead? Robert Swan (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Monday, September 26, 2005 - 02:10 pm:    After the hurricanes down here (New Orleans) need to waterproof basements - yep it was popular in the 1950s - 60s to use basements as fallout shelters/ offices - this will be the first time since the buildings where built that we could apply a "waterproofing" to the interior walls while the area is not occuppied. After treatment the areas will be occuppied again. Generic types of information would be helpful. Ellis C. Whitby, AIA, PE, CSI Senior Member Username: ecwhitby Post Number: 7 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 12:19 pm:    David; I advised our reviewer to stay with the specified manufacturer, which also has a sprayed on product. At least we have experience with the manufacturer.