Name the vinyl based products

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Author Message David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 245 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 05:11 pm:    The "Green Meanies" in the office have made an edict that we shall not use vinyl based products on our projects. I would like to send them a list of products that contain vinyl in order to emphasis to them that this is an unrealist policy. Here are the vinyl products that I can think of: VCT, vinyl wallcovering, PVC pipe, PVC coated electrical wires, PVC roofing, and vinyl windows. What else have I missed? Thanks! Tomas Mejia Senior Member Username: tmejia Post Number: 6 Registered: 09-2003 Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 05:34 pm:    If you punch in vinyl on the 4specs search engine you get 47 hits. How about crash rails/bumper rails, floor mats, vinyl sliding doors, signage, expansion joints, gypsum board and plaster accessories, window blinds, vinyl fencing and coated chain link fencing. Lynn Javoroski Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 76 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 05:41 pm:    Without waiting for my 'puter to finish searching, how about waterstops, airborne contaminate controls, tarpaulins, erosion control mats, site furnishings, ACT, some cublicles and cubicle curtains - including toilet compartments, moldings and claddings, soffit vents, cork inserts for casework, architectural precast connectors...just to name a few through division 6, anyway. Doug Brinley Advanced Member Username: dbrinley Post Number: 5 Registered: 12-2002 Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 05:47 pm:    Continued... vinyl esters are a fundamental building block for everything from food containers to medical products to office chairs, carpeting. Coatings advances rely on vinyl chemistry. Your people should have access to an organic chemist before making edicts. Lynn Javoroski Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 77 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 06:02 pm:    AND loading dock seals, bumpers, shelters; flashings; glazing splines; sliding glass door tracks; bonding agent for plaster/lath; carpet edge strips; FRP trims; WallTalkers (visual display product); shower curtains... David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 246 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 06:37 pm:    I did a search for the word "vinyl" in our specs and got this list: VCT Vinyl windows Sheet vinyl PVC pipe PVC coated electrical wires PVC single ply roofing vinyl wall covering vinyl wall base PVC coated chain link fencing PVC waterstops vinyl foam tape PVC edge banding for casework polyvinyl acetate PVA primers Polyvinylidene Fluoride (PVDF) coil coating (Kynar) polyvinyl innerlayer for laminated glass vinyl door sweeps vinyl glazing strips vinyl weatherstripping pvc sound sealant tape vinyl exterior trim vinyl corner bead PVC stretched membrane ceiling rigid vinyl retention clips for stretched ceiling and stretched wall panels vinyl vented gym base vinyl carpet reducer strips polyvinyl urea adhesive vinyl plastic corner guards vinyl signage letters vinyl shower curtain vinyl covered wall padding vinyl backed walk off mats pvc coated fiberglass shade cloth vinyl coated bleacher curtain closures pvc bleacher seats It looks like we are going to have a very limited palette of materials to work with! We will probably just have to build adobe buildings with dirt floors and straw roofs. Hey that stuff is organic as it comes! Tracy Van Niel Senior Member Username: tracy_van_niel Post Number: 69 Registered: 04-2002 Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 09:15 am:    So do these people also wear all cotton, silk, or wool clothes and 100 percent leather shoes. Do they also only use pencils for writing their edicts? But wait a minute!!! Pencils contain lead. They must use sticks and clay mixed with water to write anything, right? William C. Pegues, FCSI, CCS Senior Member Username: wpegues Post Number: 264 Registered: 10-2002 Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 09:48 am:    ooooh, 100% leather shoes - call PETA and tell them about that, then there will be no time to hassle you with dumb complaints. (((do these guys live in houses with 'plastic' shutters on them? Or how many vinyl components in the houses in which they live - tell them to clean their own house first.))) William John McGrann Senior Member Username: jmcgrann Post Number: 14 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 02:04 pm:    As us architect types know, with a little imagination, and a rich client, anything is possible! There are all kinds of alternatives to vinyl, and I'll be happy to adjust either the project budget (including my fee) or project scope to accomodate such a request. I imagine the folks at David’s office are reacting to some of the recent reporting regarding PVC on the Healthy Building Network at www.healthybuilding.net. For the alternative viewpoint, www.aboutbluevinyl.org. John. Anonymous   Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 02:06 pm:    David, I suspect that your "green meanies" may have read the healthcare IAQ article in Dec 2003 issue of Construction Specifier magazine, in which author "touches-on" PVC in bldg materials (among other materials) and to which in response, there is a "letter to editor" in March 2004 issue of same magazine. David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 248 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 02:15 pm:    I was given the following website: http://www.greenpeace.org.au/pvc/ BTW, cotton is one of the most heavily pesicide sprayed crops. Leather tanning is a nasty industry. Pencils contain graphite not lead. Fig leaves make unconfortable and provocative garments. Don't get me wrong, I am all for a more sustainable world and for eliminating toxins. I would also like to stamp out war, poverty, disease, greed, sorrow, pain, gluttony, prejudice, famine, injuries, fear, death, etc. Lynn Javoroski Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 78 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 02:22 pm:    Cotton is also a primarily genetically engineered crop. And where in the upper mid-west would I be likely to find a fig leaf anyway? Anonymous   Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 02:36 pm:    If we sent you a few, would you wear them? <G> Lynn Javoroski Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 79 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 04:04 pm:    Define "few"; indicate size of each leaf. I get to choose where and when and for how long. Tracy Van Niel Senior Member Username: tracy_van_niel Post Number: 70 Registered: 04-2002 Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 04:15 pm:    David: I know there is a downside to every item or "natural" product that's out there. I think I heard that you can even get cancer from peanut butter. Everyone needs to weigh the pros and cons and make the choice of what is right for themselves. Lynn: If you are in the upper midwest, I would sure hope that you could find some insulated fig leaves to wear because it would be too dang cold to just wear the "plain" ones. Especially right now! David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 249 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 05:23 pm:    Great! I used to live on PB & J sandwiches. Everyone I know was raised on peanut butter. I'll start shopping for coffins......non pvc materials of course. I've said this before on another post. The best thing for the environment is not to build at all.......but then we would be out of a job. I'm just really tired of the knee jerk reaction of people who blindly follow the party line without really thinking things through. Lynn Javoroski Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 80 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 05:38 pm:    Some time ago, there was a treatise circulating on the perils of water. It explained how deadly it is, how it can poison a body, destroy property, and just generally wreak havoc. And of course, this is true. But we also need water to exist (we probably don't need vinyl to exist in the same way as we need water, but as we can see above, it is pervasive in our society/culture/technology). My point is similar to David's and Tracy's. Before we make decisions, we need to analyze the situation carefully. What are the ramifications and alternatives? Then and only then, can we make informed, intelligent decisions. I have analyzed the situation: it's too darn cold for fig leaves. I'll take long silk underwear, fully lined wool pants, a long-sleeve turtle-neck wool sweater and a down-filled coat instead. Oh yeah, and water-proofed leather boots. (I've covered bugs, mammals and birds, right?) Anonymous   Posted on Thursday, March 18, 2004 - 10:48 am:    But when it comes down to it, if the "powers to be" dictate wearing of fig leaves...uninsulated...you do it...otherwise you'd be out of a job...long before we stop building. We need to better educate those "powers to be" by banning their "knee-jerk" edicts and first insisting on thorough analysis/investigation/research of the cost/benefits, etc. That way we can hopefully avoid frostbitten extremities that fig leaves can't protect! Helaine K. Robinson CCS Senior Member Username: hollyrob Post Number: 47 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Thursday, March 18, 2004 - 10:55 am:    Must be a Male Anonymous! Anonymous   Posted on Thursday, March 18, 2004 - 11:02 am:    Can't assume that anymore!! Times have really changed. John Regener, AIA, CCS, CCCA, CSI, SCIP Senior Member Username: john_regener Post Number: 154 Registered: 04-2002 Posted on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 02:08 am:    The City of Aliso Viejo, California recently considered a ban on the notoriously dangerous chemical, dihydrogen monoxide. Sanity and high school-level knowledge of chemistry, however, prevailed. Anonymous   Posted on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 11:47 am:    Dangerous in the sense that one could drown in it? Lynn Javoroski Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 81 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 12:00 pm:    That's what I was referring to in my previous message. Dihydrogen monoxide, in sufficient quantity, is toxic to humans and can cause death if that exposure is sustained over an extended period of time. Sheldon Wolfe Senior Member Username: sheldon_wolfe Post Number: 62 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 12:06 pm:    Dihydrogen monoxide is nothing to laugh at! See how dangerous it is at www.northstarcsi.com/bandhm.doc The MSDS is at www.northstarcsi.com/dhmmsds.doc Anonymous   Posted on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 12:46 pm:    It's really a problem when your head is immersed for a long period of time.