Back Coat Steel Door Frames?

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Author Message Anonymous   Posted on Monday, August 16, 2004 - 03:51 pm:    1. When should steel door frames be back coated for corrosion protection? I've seen specs that say back coat interior and exterior frames peroid, some say back coat when frames are filled w/ grout, some say only back coat when frames are filled with grout containing anti-freeze agents ( i.e.: SDI 127J). 2. When should steel door frames be filled with grout? Both interior and exterior, just exterior @ cmu, just @ cmu? Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, SCIP Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 42 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Thursday, August 19, 2004 - 04:40 pm:    We back coat all hollow metal frames with a bituminous coationg period. David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 338 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Thursday, August 19, 2004 - 05:14 pm:    We NEVER spedify backcoating on our hollow metal frames, period. Even with asphalt emulsions you can get pin holes and rusting of the door frame. We specify galvanized exterior door frames in lieu of the coating. Galvanized frames are also cheaper than bituminous coatings. Bituminous coatings may also void the fire rating of the door since there is a potential of the coating catching fire inside the frame. We rarely specify grouting of door frames. Grouting does not improve the fire rating or durability. It does deading the ringing of the frame though. Where ringing is a problem we specify high density batt insulation stuffed into the frame. The only time we specify grouting of a door frame is when the frames are installed before a masonry wall is built. That way we allow the mason to slop some grout into the frame as he builds the wall. Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, SCIP Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 43 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Thursday, August 19, 2004 - 06:09 pm:    David You are correct, we do specify galv metal frames, but we also add the bituminoys coating since most of our work is in Florida or the Carribean and galv. does not hold up. We have never had any problems with the fire rating, although it is a point worth looking at. Curious if any other specwriter has had that problem? Anne Whitacre, CCS CSI Senior Member Username: awhitacre Post Number: 111 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Friday, August 20, 2004 - 12:46 pm:    I back coat every frame, in every location, indoors and out, on every project. In this area, its difficult to get a contractor to grout a frame unless its going into a CMU or brick wall, and you can't get "pre-grouted" frames anymore -- they were so heavy no one would handle them. The pumped grout is often so watery in order to make it pumpable, that it will separate and you end up with sludge at the bottom of the frame, and 1/3 of the frame filled with water -- so that's a bad option. Grouting, as David said, mostly makes the frames sound less hollow, so filling them with insulation is a good option for that. David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 339 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Friday, August 20, 2004 - 01:18 pm:    Anne, I'm not exactly sure why you would back coat a nongrouted interior door frame? David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 340 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Friday, August 20, 2004 - 01:23 pm:    For everyone's consumption. Refer to SDI 127I-04 and SDI 127J-04. http://www.steeldoor.org/pdfs/SDI_111.pdf David Axt, AIA, CCS, CSI Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 356 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Friday, September 10, 2004 - 02:41 pm:    Doh! I gave the incorrect link. The correct link is: http://www.steeldoor.org/pdfs/SDI_127.pdf phil babinec New member Username: pbabinec Post Number: 1 Registered: 09-2004 Posted on Friday, September 10, 2004 - 04:35 pm:    We have typ. specified backcoating all frames not fully grouted for purposes of sound control. Upon reviewing above ref. tech data, it makes more sense to fill void with insulation due to 1. It's more effective, 2. More apt to actually be installed. As far as galvanizing, in addition to doors in exterior walls and un conditioned spaces, we galvanize frames in basement and similar areas that might be more exposed to moisture/standing water during construction.