"Thin brick" veneer

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Author Message David G. Axt, CCS, CSI ,SCIP Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 1693 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Tuesday, July 03, 2018 - 03:34 pm:    What do you recommend for a section number for Adhered Brick Masonry Veneer (thin brick)? MasterSpec has Section 044313.16 "Adhered Stone Masonry Veneer" but no adhered brick veneer section. David G. Axt, CCS, CSI, SCIP Specifications Consultant Axt Consulting LLC Ronald L. Geren, FCSI Lifetime Member, AIA, CCS, CCCA, CSC, SCIP Senior Member Username: specman Post Number: 1504 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Tuesday, July 03, 2018 - 03:40 pm:    Although not consistent with the stone assemblies titles, 04 21 13.23 "Surface-Bonded Brick Masonry" is provided in MasterFormat. Ron Geren, FCSI Lifetime Member, AIA, CCS, CCCA, CSC, SCIP Dewayne Dean Senior Member Username: ddean Post Number: 160 Registered: 02-2016 Posted on Tuesday, July 03, 2018 - 06:10 pm:    https://www.arcat.com/sdspecs/htm04/04_05_13lat.htm Brian E. Trimble, CDT Senior Member Username: brian_e_trimble_cdt Post Number: 103 Registered: 08-2005 Posted on Monday, July 09, 2018 - 09:23 am:    I have seen adhered thin brick specified all over the place (including from the manufacturers). I suppose I would stay away from 044313 on manufactured stone since it may have different requirements. I would think putting adhered thin brick veneer in 04 21 13 and then use any number after that. Doing it this way lets the mason contractor who is bidding the job to see that they have work here compared to another section like manufactured stone. Guest (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Monday, July 09, 2018 - 11:14 am:    I vaguely recall veneer thickness determining whether mason or tile sub performs work. If that is the case, then could be either Div 04 or Div 09? Brian E. Trimble, CDT Senior Member Username: brian_e_trimble_cdt Post Number: 104 Registered: 08-2005 Posted on Monday, July 09, 2018 - 04:28 pm:    In the past, 1 1/4" was used as the dividing line between tile and brick, but that had more to do with pavers than wall units. Now there is blending of sizes between the two sections. Although it seems like tile is getting thinner and thinner (gauged porcelain tile) and brick staying about the same in thickness (~1/2" for thin veneer units). In many cases it depends what system the thin brick is being set in. If its brick-faced precast panels its usually the masonry section. If it's being installed in a thin set application in say cafeteria then it could do either way (Div 04 or 09). J. Peter Jordan Senior Member Username: jpjordan Post Number: 1112 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Monday, February 10, 2020 - 10:52 am:    Would like to reopen this discussion. Because the think brick units are usually less than 3/4-inch think, I tend to view these as tile rather than brick (but not ceramic tile). Reinforcing this is that I would tend to use a TCNA specification, especially if the installation is an interior specification. In many cases, I would prefer that the tile person puts this stuff up rather than the mason. This may be affected by work divisions by trade in other areas. Are people still using non-MasterFormat numbers in Division 04 or Division 09? Or something else? (I do have a section I have developed for interior thin brick.) J. Peter Jordan, FCSI, AIA, CCS, LEED AP, SCIP Jeffrey Wilson CSI CCS SCIP Senior Member Username: wilsonconsulting Post Number: 328 Registered: 03-2006 Posted on Monday, February 10, 2020 - 12:41 pm:    I use 042615 "Thin Brick Masonry Veneer." If I recall, it was originally based on the MasterSpec "Adhered Stone Masonry Veneer" section -- which in my mind thin-brick installations are most like. Thin brick materials & application were imported from "Precast Architectural Concrete" where thin brick is included as an applied veneer. Most of the thin-brick specs I have developed included modular metal backup panels, which always seemed like a good method for aligning and securing the thin brick in exterior applications. These include Glen-Gery (Oldcastle) "Elite Thin Tech Panel" and "Classic Panel" and Tabs Wall Systems "TABS II Panel System" and "TABS II PLUS Rain Screen" w/ integral bldg wrap. Jeffrey Wilson CCS CSI SCIP Wilson Consulting Inc Ardmore PA Robin E. Snyder Senior Member Username: robin Post Number: 796 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Monday, February 10, 2020 - 01:13 pm:    if it's interior, i add it to my tile spec, exterior, Division 04 Brian E. Trimble, CDT Senior Member Username: brian_e_trimble_cdt Post Number: 120 Registered: 08-2005 Posted on Tuesday, February 11, 2020 - 11:58 am:    We have both mason craftworkers and tile installers who install thin brick, so it could go in either Division. I would follow local practices so that you get the proper contractors bidding the work. And as Robin suggests it will depend on whether it is interior work or exterior (Division 04 exterior and Division 09 interior). I don't think there is a wrong answer.