4specs.com    4specs.com Home Page

Bullet Resisting Fiberglass Panels Log Out | Topics | Search
Moderators | Register | Edit Profile

4specs Discussion Forum » MasterFormat 2004 Discussions » Bullet Resisting Fiberglass Panels « Previous Next »

Author Message
Ricardo Baerga-Ibáñez (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted on Friday, January 12, 2007 - 12:39 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

What number in Masterformat 2004 would apply to bullet resisting fiberglass panels? I went to Bullet Guard Co.'s website and found a section named BULLET RESISTANT PROTECTION and it is numbered as SECTION 13065 under Masterformat 95. I looked in my Masterformat 2004 book and can't seem to find it. Any ideas? Thanks in advance!
Ellis C. Whitby, AIA, PE, CSI, LEED® AP
Senior Member
Username: ecwhitby

Post Number: 24
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Friday, January 12, 2007 - 09:19 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

How about 08 88 56 - Ballistics-Resistant Glazing
Colin Gilboy
Senior Member
Username: colin

Post Number: 70
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Friday, January 12, 2007 - 09:30 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

I set up a special section in Div 13 - 13-4600 for ballistics resistant assemblies and split the components into their appropriate divisions and sections:
06-6700 - Panels
08-3950 - Doors
08-8850 - Glass
Dave Metzger
Senior Member
Username: davemetzger

Post Number: 180
Registered: 07-2001
Posted on Friday, January 12, 2007 - 09:40 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

When I've specified bullet-resistant glass fiber panels, I haven't put them in their own section, but simply as a separate article or paragraph in the section applicable to the construction of which they are a part (usually in gypsum board).
David R. Combs, CSI, CCS, CCCA
Senior Member
Username: davidcombs

Post Number: 190
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Friday, January 12, 2007 - 11:16 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

We've written a separate section -


I derived the -56 from Section 08 88 56 - Ballistics Resistant Glazing, for consistency.

Having it in a separate section allows us to specify it once, whether it be used in wall assemblies, or millwork assemblies (i.e. judges benches).
Ricardo Baerga-Ibáñez, CSI, CCS, CCCA (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted on Friday, January 12, 2007 - 06:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

Thanks for your input guys!
Senior Member
Username: ann

Post Number: 6
Registered: 03-2013
Posted on Saturday, May 24, 2014 - 05:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

This is a very old discussion - and, I found bullet-resistant panels in Division 10 (10 26 41) in MasterFormat 2014. I can see it going in 06, 10 or 13 - not in 08 because in this instance I'm specifying a wall panel - but I'm still wrestling with the best place to put it, knowing that the Spec Police might come after me. Any discussion, now so long after this discussion started?
Jeffrey Wilson CSI CCS
Senior Member
Username: wilsonconsulting

Post Number: 140
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2014 - 08:51 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

I don't quite follow the logic of its location in Wall & Door Protection. These panels are not protecting walls or doors like everything else in this category -- they protect people.

Although there is some logic in specifying these panels in a separate section for projects that involve multiple applications, I typically spec it with the assembly in which it is built. This is almost always limited to GWB partitions and architectural casework, so a simple paragraph in Part 2 of each section does the job.

I also wonder why "bullet-resistant" was selected for MasterFormat, rather than "ballistics-resistant" like other subjects.
J. Peter Jordan
Senior Member
Username: jpjordan

Post Number: 734
Registered: 05-2004
Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2014 - 11:39 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

The glass-fiber laminated panels are "products," not "work results." They are used in doors, cabinets, and wall assemblies, and never used by themselves. I wonder if the MasterFormat committee has lost sight of the fundamental understanding of the difference. MasterFormat organizes "work results" for construction, not construction products.
Sheldon Wolfe
Senior Member
Username: sheldon_wolfe

Post Number: 768
Registered: 01-2003

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2014 - 03:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

MF has many numbers, but you don't have to use them all. I get the feeling that there are too many narrow-narrow scope sections in use. I agree with Jeffrey; if a product is part of an assembly, I usually specify it as part of that assembly, rather than in its own section.
Ronald L. Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP
Senior Member
Username: specman

Post Number: 1224
Registered: 03-2003

Posted on Tuesday, May 27, 2014 - 11:57 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

For the most part I would agree with everyone regarding specifying it in the section of which it is part of an assembly.

However, for the sake of complying with the "say it once and in the right place" mantra, I have specified a product section to which the other sections may reference. For example, in a courthouse project, the ballistic-resistant panels are used in architectural woodwork and wall assemblies. Why repeat the "product" requirements twice--once in each section--if the product used is the same?

Now, I'll agree that this doesn't apply to everything. For example, plastic laminate, which is used in several assemblies, but is usually not afforded its own section, can be used in multiple sections: casework, counters, doors, etc. However, p-lam typically consists of a paragraph or two in each applicable section.

On the other hand, ballistic-resistant panels have unique performance requirements, special installation requirements, and are responsible for saving lives. Therefore, it might be prudent to generate a product-based specification to avoid conflicts or, more importantly, omissions, which can be present when specifying the same item in multiple locations.
Sheldon Wolfe
Senior Member
Username: sheldon_wolfe

Post Number: 770
Registered: 01-2003

Posted on Tuesday, May 27, 2014 - 02:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

This is a case where I might have a separate section for the reasons Ron states. The problem is, it appears that many people who write specifications are not really specifiers, and don't understand the options, or know they exist.

Drawing and specifying are full-contact sports; mindlessly clicking links, drawing or deleting lines, and modifying master specifications while listening to your favorite tunes and daydreaming about the coming weekend simply don't work.
Lynn Javoroski FCSI CCS LEED® AP SCIP Affiliate
Senior Member
Username: lynn_javoroski

Post Number: 1820
Registered: 07-2002

Posted on Tuesday, May 27, 2014 - 03:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post

OH RATS! you've burst my bubble!

Add Your Message Here
Username: Posting Information:
This is a public posting area. Enter your username and password if you have an account. Otherwise, enter your full name as your username and leave the password blank. Your e-mail address is optional.
Options: Automatically activate URLs in message

Topics | Last Day | Last Week | Tree View | Search | Help/Instructions | Program Credits Administration