Interns and Specs

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Author Message Dewayne Dean Senior Member Username: ddean Post Number: 98 Registered: 02-2016 Posted on Wednesday, November 02, 2016 - 04:58 pm:    I thought this was worth sharing Margaret G. Chewning FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: presbspec Post Number: 282 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Wednesday, November 02, 2016 - 06:49 pm:    Yeah, after I left one of my A/E employers, I when back to visit a colleague and was approached by a number of the younger group with questions. Boss thought he could replace me with the group just out of school. Hope they didn't have too much trouble during CA. Steven Bruneel, AIA, CSI-CDT, LEED-AP, EDAC Senior Member Username: redseca2 Post Number: 561 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, November 02, 2016 - 07:17 pm:    I recall a young intern at my first real architecture job, when I was barely past intern status myself. This young intern had attended one of the very best east coast architecture schools and had learned both how to work long hours as well as design theory. To prove both, he came in one weekend to work on the office tenant improvement project we had assigned him to. In school, he had learned to organize your design to reflect the relative importance of building elements or spaces. Running with this ball, he had the redrawn all of the floor plans (this was in the hand drawn 1980's) to reflect the hierarchy of spaces in the size of the doors to them. Next Monday morning we all looked on in awe at the pair of 4x8 doors added to the CEO's office and how now all of the bathroom doors were now 2 feet wide, and so on and so on. Michael Chusid, RA FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: michael_chusid Post Number: 227 Registered: 10-2003 Posted on Wednesday, November 02, 2016 - 09:57 pm:    I was that intern, once. And am glad they gave me the chance. Fortunately, it was at an office that did not do very innovative work, so I had prior projects I could use as reference. Michael Chusid, RA FCSI CCS www.chusid.com www.buildingproduct.guru 818-219-4937 Phil Kabza Senior Member Username: phil_kabza Post Number: 571 Registered: 12-2002 Posted on Monday, November 07, 2016 - 07:00 am:    Relating to Steven's comment above: I once worked alongside an architect in a facilities office who explained this phenomenon. People would come to Mark (University of Virginia) to learn what the new building design meant; they would come to me (University of Michigan) to discuss how to build it. Louis Medcalf, FCSI, CCS Senior Member Username: louis_medcalf Post Number: 68 Registered: 11-2010 Posted on Monday, November 21, 2016 - 03:45 pm:    Radical idea: NCARB should require CDT as qualification for registration since they are not interested in creating a meaningful exam on specs. I keep running into registered architects with 10+ years of experience who don't know the difference between general conditions and general requirements. J. Peter Jordan Senior Member Username: jpjordan Post Number: 922 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Monday, November 21, 2016 - 05:29 pm:    NCARB does give IDP credit for participating in a CDT class or passing the CDT exasm J. Peter Jordan, FCSI, AIA, CCS, LEED AP, SCIP Intern Architect, CSI, CCS (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Monday, November 21, 2016 - 06:04 pm:    Earlier this year, NCARB had streamlined IDP getting rid of the requirement for elective hours greatly diminishing the appeal to candidates to pursue the CDT. I posted about this back in April: http://discus.4specs.com/discus/messages/26/4467.html?1429620761 Then in June, NCARB overhauled IDP and renamed it the Architectural Experience Program (AXP) and they no longer give any credit to candidates for passing the CDT exam. They continue to give 40 hours each for earning the CCS and CCCA certificates in appropriate AXP categories. http://www.ncarb.org/Experience-Through-Internships/IDP2-Experience-Categories-Areas/Overhauled-IDP.aspx Sheldon Wolfe Senior Member Username: sheldon_wolfe Post Number: 932 Registered: 01-2003 Posted on Tuesday, November 22, 2016 - 02:01 am:    I guess that's the two steps back. Although it would be great if architects had a CCS or CCCA, the odds are less than for them getting the CDT because it will take more time, and few will be interested. And then there's the experience requirement... I don't expect architects to get either certification, especially early in their careers. Those who need them may or may not get them, but that will happen long after they're licensed. I do want them to understand basic relationships between documents of all types, to know what's in the general conditions and in Division 01, and to understand that the information on drawings is intimately related to the information in the specifications. The best way they can learn all of that is by getting a CDT. If they want to pursue certification, so much the better. Intern Architect, CSI, CCS (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Tuesday, November 22, 2016 - 11:53 am:    I can tell you that the ARE sufficiently covers those topics; basic relationships between documents, what's in General Conditions and Div 01, coordination between drawings and specifications, etc. However, most ARE candidates "learn" this stuff just long enough to pass, then forget it. Only those who are interested in learning and retaining this information are going to pursue getting a CDT, and the truth is not many are interested in it. If they were, they are probably the type of person that would learn and retain this information from the ARE anyway, without needing to study for and pass the CDT. The sad truth is that CSI doesn't promote the value of a CDT enough. I've advised aspiring architects to pass the CDT first and then take the ARE. The content of the CDT will help immensely with the content of multiple divisions of the ARE (those with historically the lowest pass rates: http://www.ncarb.org/ARE/ARE-Pass-Rates/DivisionPR.aspx). If CSI could tap into that, a great number of future architects would be willing to pass the CDT because they will see value. In essence it is a relatively cheap study program that also will set them apart in the profession. Probably even more so with the changing of the ARE divisions where knowledge gained in the process of earning a CDT will apply not only for 1 or 2 divisions, but instead across almost all divisions covering content in 4-5 of the new divisions (http://www.ncarb.org/ARE/ARE5/~/media/Files/PDF/Brochure/ARE5_CreditModel.ashx). However, CSI can't even get NCARB to acknowledge that the old CSI Manual of Practice has been replaced with newer, more up-to-date publications and get NCARB to list those as resources when studying for the ARE (see page 168: http://www.ncarb.org/ARE/ARE-Pass-Rates/DivisionPR.aspx). Intern Architect, CSI, CCS (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Tuesday, November 22, 2016 - 12:16 pm:    Apologies, that last link should be this one: http://www.ncarb.org/ARE/~/media/Files/PDF/ARE-Exam-Guides/ARE5-Handbook.pdf