Concrete vs Steel Stairs

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Author Message Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1878 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Thursday, April 19, 2018 - 08:00 pm:    Which is better, CIP Concrete stairs or prefab metal with concrete filled pans? Is the steel less $$$? Considering a three story mixed use building containing residential and retail, which is better? So many questions, so little time and its not even Friday yet. Nathan Woods, CSI, CCCA, LEED AP Senior Member Username: nwoods Post Number: 736 Registered: 08-2005 Posted on Thursday, April 19, 2018 - 08:13 pm:    If its wood framed construction, you would not want steel stairs due to differential settlement. The wood frame will compress up to an inch, leaving the stairs sitting high. My contractors typically prefer wood stringers and precast concrete treads for wood framed multifamily structures Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1879 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Thursday, April 19, 2018 - 08:18 pm:    Sorry Nathan, it feels like a Friday, to clarify building is CBS (Concrete Block Stucco) Typical Florida Construction, no wood frame. Nathan Woods, CSI, CCCA, LEED AP Senior Member Username: nwoods Post Number: 737 Registered: 08-2005 Posted on Thursday, April 19, 2018 - 08:20 pm:    Well, the rationale behind preferring the precast treads still exists. No lead time, easy to replace trade damage with new treads. Allows the contractor to use the stairs during construction. Mark Gilligan SE, Senior Member Username: mark_gilligan Post Number: 855 Registered: 10-2007 Posted on Friday, April 20, 2018 - 12:29 am:    The world of wood has changed. With the increasingly common use of engineered wood for floor framing shrinkage in the floor is less of an issue. They are now contemplating 10+ stories of wood most likely involving CLT. I expect that these structures will use steel for the lateral system. This is possible because of the use of dry lumber. Wayne Yancey Senior Member Username: wayne_yancey Post Number: 866 Registered: 01-2008 Posted on Friday, April 20, 2018 - 09:46 am:    Jerome, In the PNW we will use pre-engineered steel stairs with concrete filled pans. Only restriction is if the stairs will be exposed to rain, ie. not enclosed by 4 walls and a roof. For these conditions, we specify precast treads/risers/landings, steel stringers. I think CIP stairs will be more $ than drop in steel or precast. All the forming for CIP is labor intensive carpentry and shoring work. I would prefer something fabricated indoors in a climate controlled environment. Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1880 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Friday, April 20, 2018 - 10:03 am:    Thx, one of my clients refuses to use prefab steel stairs because he claims its too noisy. In Florida, concrete (and concrete block) is king. ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1165 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2018 - 05:12 pm:    Hi Jerry. It's one of those "It depends" questions. Concrete structure pretty much results in concrete stairs, except for maybe in Philly which I still don't understand but I do what I'm told. In some locations like DC where most structures are concrete (lower floor-to-floor due to building height restrictions), Contractors often precast the stairs onsite and then drop them in place. Pretty neat actually. So I have another question for the crowd when discussing metal pan stairs. We typically spec poured-in place treads. We have a Contractor that wants to swap out for precast treads, either drop in or honeycomb backed and applied on top of a flat plate. I get it. It's cheap. It's fast. It's lightweight so it saves structural costs. All of that is fine IF IT WORKS AS WELL!! So the question is, does it? Are the aesthetics (okay, metal pan stairs not all that pretty), the performance, and the longevity the same? This is for back-of-house so aesthetics may not matter as much but they're going to get a lot of traffic. Any real-world experience, good or bad, is appreciated.