Carlisle Sure-Flex KEE 50 mil membrane

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Author Message Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1729 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Monday, January 16, 2017 - 12:20 pm:    Anyone have any experience with this roofing product? A contractor has proposed this as an equal to Seaman's Fibertite fully adhered 45 mil membrane which I have successfully specified for past five years over poured concrete and LWIC. The Carlsile membrane is relatively new. ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1029 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Monday, January 16, 2017 - 01:18 pm:    I've not used their KEE yet and have never used any of their products over LWIC. I always find that to be a bit more tricky than regular concrete or insulated metal deck. While Carlisle has always stood behind their products I would still request a list of successful projects in your area including contact info for the building owners/managers. It's time out of your day but worth calling. I've received lists from other manufacturers and found that several of the contacts were very dissatisfied with product, installation, or service. Better to know in advance. Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1730 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Monday, January 16, 2017 - 01:44 pm:    We have a lot of successful projects, incl many condos using Fibertite over LWIC, but it may no longer be competitive, so alternatives are being considered. Yes you do need an experienced crew and superintendent. We can achieve some awesome uplifts, but the bottom line is always the in place cost. Ken you and I think alike, I've asked for the list of successful projects, seems like ours would be the first in So FL. I need to reach out to the Carlisle rep, but today I have a fierce head cold, this may be a short day, can barely keep my eyes open (swollen). I don't know how you northerners deal with cold weather, I like it hot, hot, hot. ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1030 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Monday, January 16, 2017 - 01:54 pm:    Hope you feel better my friend. I hate being the first kid on the block to try out a new system, especially with your kind of windloads. Have they ever installed over LWIC anywhere else? Do they have an FM RoofNav tested system over LWIC? If not I'd be hesitant to let them do it. They better be coming in way low with all kinds of caveats to protect everyone in case it doesn't work. Something like "We'll pay for the specified system if ours fails." Dewayne Dean Senior Member Username: ddean Post Number: 114 Registered: 02-2016 Posted on Monday, January 16, 2017 - 03:11 pm:    We just had a Lunch n Learn last week with Carlisle. They assured us that there products will perform better than anything else on the market Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1731 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Monday, January 16, 2017 - 03:26 pm:    Thanks Dwayne, but have you ever had a rep tell you different regard a product they are promoting? Every rep I have spoken to considers their product to be the best, its part of being a good rep. I've never taken any CDT courses, but I am willing to bet the golden rule for REP 101 is "never put down your product". Sorry for the cynicism, this cold has me feeing horrible, can't leave the office yet. Dewayne Dean Senior Member Username: ddean Post Number: 115 Registered: 02-2016 Posted on Monday, January 16, 2017 - 03:32 pm:    Jerome, sorry you are not feeling well. My post was meant as a joke, hence the smiley faces. Of course every rep will say theirs is the best. Best of luck to you. Guest (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Monday, January 16, 2017 - 08:08 pm:    Jerome, 1. All reps say their product is the best...or at least better than the competition. 2. Most, but not all reps denigrate their competition's products. 3. I agree with Ken, do you really want your client/owner to be the "guinea pig" in SFL? ken hercenberg Senior Member Username: khercenberg Post Number: 1032 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Tuesday, January 17, 2017 - 09:58 am:    Actually I've been blessed with some Golden Reps who tell me when their products won't work for certain situations. They even steer me to the right product or help me work out the project so we're not combatting the laws of physics. The ones I get irked with are those who tell me I should redesign our projects so that their products will work. They don't get invited back. Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1732 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Tuesday, January 17, 2017 - 01:31 pm:    Fortunately there is a Building Envelope Consultant on the project during construction. Their roof consultant gave a thumbs down to using the Carlisle KEE vs Fibertite. Unfortunately I can not share his opinion, but it did reinforce my dedication to the Seaman product which I have specified since 2009. To be fair the Carlisle rep did offer examples of other installations in South Florida, but the Roof Consultant's argument was very convincing. Paul Sweet (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 12:27 pm:    One of the points I remember the Fibertite rep. making was that Fibertite used a heavier mesh than other single-ply manufacturers, which provided better puncture resistance. This was a few years ago when their main competition was PVC & TPO.