EPS TRIM ?

Log Out | Topics | Search Moderators | Register | Edit Profile

Author Message Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1719 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Monday, December 12, 2016 - 11:12 am:    FBC limits the use of architectural trim in Type I building to no more than 40 feet above grade. The architectural trim above 40 ft must be non-combustible. If the trim is expanded polystyrene covered with cement plaster, per ASTM C 926 we must use metal lath. Is there any ASTM standard that allows glass fiber mesh to be used in lieu of metal? How is EIFS applied at those heights with fiberglass mesh? Louis Medcalf, FCSI, CCS Senior Member Username: louis_medcalf Post Number: 69 Registered: 11-2010 Posted on Tuesday, January 03, 2017 - 05:15 pm:    In addition to IBC limitations on the thickness of EIFS trim because of the fuel it adds, there is the issue of securement: if a maintenance worker puts a foot on it, will it give way? Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1726 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Tuesday, January 03, 2017 - 05:53 pm:    Louis, all I can say is that is a very dumb maintenance worker to use trim as a foot hold, SFL is the land of litigation and stupid workers, but I've never heard of any worker falling to his death because the trim failed to support his weight. Ronald L. Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP Senior Member Username: specman Post Number: 1432 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Tuesday, January 03, 2017 - 07:07 pm:    It's actually a very wise thing to consider. The fire departments here I the Phoenix metro area will comment on such trim, because it can prove dangerous for firefighters attempting to get to the roof via ladder. Ron Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP www.specsandcodes.com Steven Bruneel, AIA, CSI-CDT, LEED-AP, EDAC Senior Member Username: redseca2 Post Number: 567 Registered: 12-2006 Posted on Tuesday, January 03, 2017 - 08:09 pm:    You also need to design window washing platforms, tie-backs for life lines and other such things so that they never bear on the architectural trim. Even a ladder leaned against the trim at the base can ruin it. J. Peter Jordan Senior Member Username: jpjordan Post Number: 924 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Wednesday, January 04, 2017 - 10:49 am:    One of the firms that I used to work at would incorporate a fairly wide EIFS cornice/coping at the top of the wall and would call for a stencil "Not a Step" every 50 feet or so on the top of an EIFS coping. J. Peter Jordan, FCSI, AIA, CCS, LEED AP, SCIP David J. Wyatt, CDT Senior Member Username: david_j_wyatt_cdt Post Number: 158 Registered: 03-2011 Posted on Wednesday, January 04, 2017 - 12:58 pm:    That is a very good idea, Peter. There may be other building components for which that might be considered. I do wonder if it should be stenciled in other languages as well. When we create building elements that look like one thing (stone, for example) but behave like another (plastic), we cannot entirely blame the uninformed person for mistaking it for the real thing. During my early dumb days as a fence erector, I leaned a heavy spud bar against what appeared to be a concrete wall and put a hole in it. It was my first experience with a thin EIFS application. It was also my first experience in paying for damage I caused with my already meager earnings. Guest (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Wednesday, January 04, 2017 - 01:16 pm:    David Don't know when or where your payback occurred but at least now/here in Calif (and I presume many/most other states), labor laws forbid employers from assessing employees for damages, errors, mistakes, etc. while in the capacity of performing their jobs (excepting proven gross negligence, or dishonest or willful acts; keyword here is proven...by employer). So unless your employer can "prove" you were grossly negligent, dishonest or willful, payback is unlawful. Federal labor laws are less-restrictive. Lynn Javoroski FCSI CCS LEEDŽ AP SCIP Affiliate Senior Member Username: lynn_javoroski Post Number: 2107 Registered: 07-2002 Posted on Wednesday, January 04, 2017 - 05:30 pm:    Is there an international symbol for "Not a Step"? (Some graphic in a slashed circle?) George A. Everding, FCSI, CCS, CCCA, AIA Senior Member Username: geverding Post Number: 841 Registered: 11-2004 Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2017 - 12:51 pm:    Lynn: https://www.redrockdecals.com/aircraft-stickers/aircraft-notice-stickers/no-step (And I didn't need Edd Soenke's help finding it...) J. Peter Jordan Senior Member Username: jpjordan Post Number: 925 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2017 - 12:53 pm:    I doubt the decals would work for the EIFS surface. J. Peter Jordan, FCSI, AIA, CCS, LEED AP, SCIP Dave Metzger Senior Member Username: davemetzger Post Number: 673 Registered: 07-2001 Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2017 - 01:22 pm:    I don't know, Peter. Could just wing it. Anon (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2017 - 11:14 am:    Or if you are in a location where workers generally do not wear shoes ... Mark Gilligan SE, Senior Member Username: mark_gilligan Post Number: 807 Registered: 10-2007 Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2017 - 09:46 pm:    Ron What is the basis for the fire departments requirement/request? Code sections would be appreciated? Ronald L. Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP Senior Member Username: specman Post Number: 1433 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2017 - 11:37 pm:    Their concern is accessing the roof via ladder and stepping onto foam trim cornices at parapet walls that would not have enough support. There is no specific requirement, but if the depth of the trim is large enough to cause concern, they will comment on it. Ron Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP www.specsandcodes.com Jerome J. Lazar, RA, CCS, CSI, NCARB Senior Member Username: lazarcitec Post Number: 1727 Registered: 05-2003 Posted on Monday, January 09, 2017 - 01:18 am:    Is anyone going to answer my original Query? Ron it seems your post hijacked my thread post. Ronald L. Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP Senior Member Username: specman Post Number: 1434 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Monday, January 09, 2017 - 01:44 am:    Actually, I think Louis did, but I'll take the blame. I don't know of anything that will allow the use of glass fiber mesh in lieu of metal lath. Per IBC Section 1406.2, the exception to the limitations requires compliance with Chapter 26. Chapter 26 requires compliance with NFPA 285 for exterior walls. EIFS is required to comply with ASTM E 2568, which requires compliance with NFPA 285, and if the exterior wall complies with the other requirements per IBC Section 2603.5, then the 40-foot height limitation doesn't apply. Ron Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP www.specsandcodes.com