| Author |
Message |
Bruce Konschuh
Senior Member
Username: brucek
Post Number: 23
Registered: 08-2014
| | Posted on Monday, March 19, 2018 - 06:43 pm: |    |
problem: in locations where contractor has framed openings in walls (corners for doors, windows, etc.), he has used machine screws, which have a rounded top. well, line up a few of these rounded top screws, and the GWB will not install tight to the the metal stud line, it bumps out away from studs and then when you try to install ceiling grid angle, the wall is wavy. Contractor then needs to caulk at uneven wall/ceiling joint, or fill gap some other way.
solution: how to specify that mtl framing and screws shall not be installed past the metal stud plane (to allow GWB to be installed tight to metal stud). Are there any construction associations you are aware of that addresses this issue? GA-214 does not get down to this level of detail. |
J. Peter Jordan
Senior Member
Username: jpjordan
Post Number: 1025
Registered: 05-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 20, 2018 - 10:14 am: | |
I believe that there should be no fasteners on the stud flange face onto which drywall will be installed. Tracks are fastened to substrates and the studs are "inserted" into the track for a friction fit. When the drywall is installed, the drywall screws tie everything together. Too many fasteners on the framing will result in a rigid frame which will cause more problems when the building begins to move.
Although it is probably too late now, the whole mess should have been rejected. In my view, the framing sub should be asked to participate the remedial work caused by his action. When he coomplains that he will loose money, my response would be "Good; maybe you will do it right next time."
J. Peter Jordan, FCSI, AIA, CCS, LEED AP, SCIP
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J. Peter Jordan
Senior Member
Username: jpjordan
Post Number: 1026
Registered: 05-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 20, 2018 - 10:27 am: | |
OK; after doing some more checking, I am seeing that USG's installation manual states "...anchor only those studs adjacent to door and borrowed light frames. This would also be applicable to partition intersections and corners." (see https://www.usg.com/content/dam/USG_Marketing_Communications/canada/product_promotional_materials/finished_assets/cgc-construction-handbook-ch02-framing-can-en.pdf)
J. Peter Jordan, FCSI, AIA, CCS, LEED AP, SCIP
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Bruce Konschuh
Senior Member
Username: brucek
Post Number: 24
Registered: 08-2014
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 20, 2018 - 11:06 am: | |
J. Peter, thank you for your input - the USG manual may help. And as far as installer saying he will lose money, he has already asked for a Change Order. |
Wayne Yancey
Senior Member
Username: wayne_yancey
Post Number: 860
Registered: 01-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 20, 2018 - 12:22 pm: | |
Peter,
I suggest a clarification that your first two sentences refer to non-load bearing interior walls.
Jack studs or cripples installed below windowsills, above window and door heads and elsewhere to furnish supports, shall be securely attached to supporting members, with screws.
Or was this implied in your reply?
Some installers get carried away like a framer with a nailing gun. |
J. Peter Jordan
Senior Member
Username: jpjordan
Post Number: 1027
Registered: 05-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 20, 2018 - 01:51 pm: | |
Wayne; point taken. The USG manual has recommendations for those areas as well. I do think the reference to "pan head" screws in the manual should be revised to "flat head" where gypsum panels are to be installed over the fastener.
J. Peter Jordan, FCSI, AIA, CCS, LEED AP, SCIP
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David G. Axt, CCS, CSI ,SCIP
Senior Member
Username: david_axt
Post Number: 1643
Registered: 03-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 20, 2018 - 02:04 pm: | |
Bruce,
I think you meant "pan-head self-drilling screw" instead of "round-head machine screw". (page 43 of USG 'The Gypsum Construction Handbook - 7th edition')
The pan head does slightly protrude above the surface of the stud and will cause slight waviness to the gypsum board. because of this I specify that the acoustic ceiling grid angle trim have acoustical sealant applied.
I also typically specify deflection track where the deck is anticipated to flex.
I'm not sure this is code compliant anymore, but I used to see framers use a device that would punch a 3 sided small square hole that would hold the stud to the track until the gypsum board was installed.
David G. Axt, CCS, CSI, SCIP
Specifications Consultant
Axt Consulting LLC |
Wayne Yancey
Senior Member
Username: wayne_yancey
Post Number: 861
Registered: 01-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 20, 2018 - 05:18 pm: | |
I consulted Terry Kastner, Executive Director for the Northwest Wall and Ceiling Bureau.
Here is Terry's reply:
"ASTM C754 is referenced by the Code for interior non-load bearing framing. Studs must be anchored to the track member, adjacent to doors, window frames, partition intersections, and corners. They shall be anchored by means of screws, or by crimping. At other locations ASTM C754 states that studs shall engage both the floor and ceiling runners. The installer does have the option of not anchoring those studs to the track BUT, it is industry standard to screw the studs to the top and bottom track to hold them on the required layout, by ASTM C754, and necessary to prevent follow on trades, electrical, plumbing etc. from moving them off layout. In some cases the building inspector insists that we screw both sides of the stud to the track members. In those cases, I usually get called in. Trust me, framers would prefer to use as few fasteners as possible but we must use them to keep the studs at the required spacing. If the proper framing screws are used, the pan-head, as pointed out by David, the effect to the flat plane of the installed drywall is negligible."
"Some metal framing manufacturers now make a deflection track that has tabs in the flange that fold down on either side of the stud securing the stud on layout. So if there is an overriding concern with the use of the proper fasteners holding the stud on layout, specify this type of track. But be advised, it will be a much more costly material than standard track and equal to or greater in price than slotted slip track. Either way, at those locations noted in ASTM C754 anchoring is not an option, it is mandated."
Wayne again. The fasteners I am familiar with for steel studs have the modified truss head (Philips drive with a washer type head).
Wayne |
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