WRB = ?

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Author Message David G. Axt, CCS, CSI ,SCIP Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 1593 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 - 03:58 pm:    Which term do you prefer: A) Water-Resistant Barrier B) Water-Resistant Barrier C) Weather-Resistant Barrier D) Weather-Resistive Barrier E) Other ________________ David G. Axt, CCS, CSI, SCIP Specifications Consultant Axt Consulting LLC Ronald L. Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP Senior Member Username: specman Post Number: 1468 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 - 04:17 pm:    What's the difference between A and B? The IBC refers to it as a "water-resistive barrier," which doesn't appear on your list (I assume it was supposed to be B). Ron Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP www.specsandcodes.com David G. Axt, CCS, CSI ,SCIP Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 1594 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 - 04:25 pm:    Ron, You are correct. I meant to say. B) Water-Resistive Barrier David G. Axt, CCS, CSI, SCIP Specifications Consultant Axt Consulting LLC Richard Baxter, AIA, CSI, CDT Senior Member Username: rbaxter Post Number: 128 Registered: 12-2004 Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 - 05:03 pm:    Here’s my over-analysis of the issue, which coincidentally led me to the same term that the IBC uses: First, “weather” seems inaccurate since weather includes many things, such as heat, humidity, sunshine, wind, rain, etc. Weather barriers are not designed to resist all aspects of weather, especially heat. “Water” resistance could imply that the barrier resists all forms of water, including vapors. But since we have a different term for vapor barriers, a water barrier is understood to be designed primary to resist liquid water infiltration. Obviously it resists other aspects of the weather too, but I think architects generally are looking for water resistance. If vapor is their concern, they’ll ask for a vapor barrier, which generally also serves to resist water. And if air is a concern, they’ll ask for an air barrier, which generally also resists vapor and water. Suffix “-ant” means “denoting attribution of an action or state” Suffix “-ive” means “tending to; having the nature of” “-ant” seems to be saying the item has this attribute and therefore can be used to do something, whereas “-ant” seems to be saying it is in the very nature of the item and therefore it always will do something. I therefore vote for “-ant” as the slightly more accurate suffix, because the barrier does not necessarily always resist water, but it can resist water when installed properly. I therefore think it should be A, a water-resistant barrier David G. Axt, CCS, CSI ,SCIP Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 1595 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 - 06:12 pm:    Here is an interesting article I found while poking around on the internet. https://www.constructionspecifier.com/wrb/ David G. Axt, CCS, CSI, SCIP Specifications Consultant Axt Consulting LLC Anonymous (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 - 04:15 pm:    E) Other as follows depending on context ... 1) Weather barrier (based on MasterFormat) 2) Water-resistive barrier (based on IBC) Brett Scarfino (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 - 11:47 pm:    E) Other (to perhaps elaborate on Richard's post): 1) Air and water barrier 2) Air, water, and vapor barrier. "barrier" is used loosely here for sake of discussion. I would approach most all projects as needing both an air and water resistive barrier (IECC / IBC), and perhaps also a vapor barrier (IBC). While it might not be applicable to your projects/wall types, I typically see one layer (fluid or a sheet/membrane), satisfying two or more of these functions. So I've found it more instructive to identify as simply an air-water or air-water-vapor barrier. Again, this is for sake of general discussion with project groups who may or may not be familiar. As a specification matter, I commonly see generic fluid applied membrane air barrier systems... where one must dig into the spec'd properties (or product) to determine the design intent; one example - is it a permeable or an impermeable system? So, I've never really seen issues identifying these layers generically, "weather resistive barrier", so as long as the specs provide clarity. David G. Axt, CCS, CSI ,SCIP Senior Member Username: david_axt Post Number: 1601 Registered: 03-2002 Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2017 - 12:14 pm:    I work for various architectural firms that use different names for the same product. I still specify these products in Section 072500 but have to run a "search and replace" to change the name throughout that section and project manual. MasterSpec and MasterFormat simply the term by just calling it "Weather Barriers". David G. Axt, CCS, CSI, SCIP Specifications Consultant Axt Consulting LLC Dewayne Dean Senior Member Username: ddean Post Number: 137 Registered: 02-2016 Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2017 - 07:07 pm:    BSD offers this: A. Weather Barrier: Assemblies that form either water-resistive barriers, air barriers, or vapor retarders. B. Air Barrier: Air tight barrier made of material that is relatively air impermeable but water vapor permeable, both to the degree specified, with sealed seams and with sealed joints to adjacent surfaces. Note: For the purposes of this specification, vapor impermeable air barriers are classified as vapor retarders. C. Vapor Retarder: Air tight barrier made of material that is relatively water vapor impermeable, to the degree specified, with sealed seams and with sealed joints to adjacent surfaces. D. Water-Resistive Barrier: Water-shedding barrier made of material that is moisture resistant, to the degree specified, intended to be installed to shed water without sealed seams. Michael Chusid, RA FCSI CCS Senior Member Username: michael_chusid Post Number: 316 Registered: 10-2003 Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2017 - 07:29 pm:    We toss around terms like weather barrier, air barrier, vapor retarder or the rest as if they have meaning. They don't, as this discussion illustrates. Instead, I propose that items on drawings be given random names (see http://www.desiquintans.com/articles/noungenerator.php for appropriate words). For example, an arrow could could be drawn to point to a location in a wall section and identify the location as "LIMO". The contractor, having no idea what "LIMO" means in this context, would have to rely on the project specifications for a definition. "LIMO", for example, could be described as a sheet type product with certain perm rating and burst strength. I realize there are a few kinks in this system that have not been resolved. But there are also kinks in a system that relies on acronyms such as "WRB". Michael Chusid, RA FCSI CCS www.chusid.com www.buildingproduct.guru 818-219-4937