| Author |
Message |
Robin E. Snyder
Senior Member
Username: robin
Post Number: 680
Registered: 08-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 24, 2017 - 01:19 pm: |    |
For example, if a product is tested for flame spread per ASTM E84 in 2001, but that standard has been updated several times since then, at what point is the testing data considered obsolete? It isn't reasonable to expect companies to re-test every time an ASTM is updated, so how long are the test results typically valid? |
Mark Gilligan SE,
Senior Member
Username: mark_gilligan
Post Number: 818
Registered: 10-2007
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 24, 2017 - 01:34 pm: | |
The question isn't how long the results are valid but rather does the supplied product conform to the standard specified.
A revised standard could very well require new testing unless the changes would not impact the specific product. As a minimum there should be a report indicating why new testing is not required.
For example if the new standard was less conservative then new testing would not be needed.
Retesting would also be needed if they had changed the formulation of the product. |
Michael Chusid, RA FCSI CCS
Senior Member
Username: michael_chusid
Post Number: 285
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 24, 2017 - 02:13 pm: | |
I was recently asked to write a guide spec for a manufacturer. Their product literature cites performance according to ASTM Dxxxz-1977. (And, of course, they didn't have the lab report anymore, but that's another issue.)
In the 40 years since the 1977 edition of the standard, the standard was revised several times and then cancelled. (And I suspect the product has changed, too.)
Fortunately, when I explained this to my client, they agreed to perform new testing.
Michael Chusid, RA FCSI CCS
www.chusid.com www.buildingproduct.guru 818-219-4937 |
Brian E. Trimble, CDT
Senior Member
Username: brian_e_trimble_cdt
Post Number: 93
Registered: 08-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 24, 2017 - 04:22 pm: | |
In the masonry industry we usually require units to be tested within 24 months or in some cases 12 months. In many cases, raw materials and processes change very little over time and therefore the properties are usually pretty consistent.
As for changing standards, the masonry standards, especially the physical properties requirements in those standards, hardly change. Most of the changes to the masonry standards are interpretation and/or clarification improvements. But the year of standard adoption is important whenever you specify anything. |
John Bunzick, CCS, CCCA, LEED AP
Senior Member
Username: bunzick
Post Number: 1716
Registered: 03-2002
| | Posted on Friday, May 26, 2017 - 02:34 pm: | |
It also depends upon the standard issuer and what their rules are to maintain conformance. Some standards issuers will allow an older test to be considered conforming for a stated number of years after the new standard was issued. The manufacturer would have to state which edition of the standard the test was used, but the product is not considered non-conforming just because it hasn't been tested to the latest version. Of course, you then need to look at what the code in effect requires for conformance under the standard.
I don't think there is a bright line here, but certainly something tested 40 years ago should not be considered conforming. On the other hand, if some modest changes to a standard were made, say, three years ago, is the fact that the test may be four years old sufficient to say it's non-conforming in more than a technical way? That is, does the product still do what we need it to do even if the standard has been updated a bit? |
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