| Author |
Message |
Wayne Yancey
Senior Member
Username: wayne_yancey
Post Number: 731
Registered: 01-2008
| | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 01:42 pm: |    |
Calling all specifiers.
It is Monday a.m. and I'm not in a creative frame of mind. I am seeking sample wording for submittal requirements for thermal modeling calculations for exterior enclosure with curtain wall.
Thanks,
Wayne |
Mark Gilligan SE,
Senior Member
Username: mark_gilligan
Post Number: 718
Registered: 10-2007
| | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 01:57 pm: | |
You may be over thinking this issue.
I assume that you are delegating this part of the design to the contractor similar to when steel connection designs are delegated to the contractor. So why not treat it the same.
Who will be reviewing the submittal? Unless a member of the design team intends to perform the review then why ask for the calculations. If you have a reviewer he/she should be involved in specifying the submittal requirements.
Have you specified the nature of the analyses required and the performance criteria? |
Wayne Yancey
Senior Member
Username: wayne_yancey
Post Number: 732
Registered: 01-2008
| | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 02:01 pm: | |
Client request.
Yes, the curtain wall spec is a performance spec.
Your other questions are duly noted but are beside the point at this time. |
Mark Gilligan SE,
Senior Member
Username: mark_gilligan
Post Number: 719
Registered: 10-2007
| | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 02:50 pm: | |
If the Client wants the Calculations but nobody on the design team intends to review them then you need only say submit calculations.
Why does the Client want the calculations submitted and what is the client's expectations as to what will be done with them?
Unless these questions are resolved now you will likely find that during construction somebody will be asked to review the calculations. The designated reviewer may not have the expertise to review the calculations or may not have the fee nor want the liability.
If nobody intends to review the calculations then suggest that the specifications make it clear that they are submitted for information only and will not be reviewed. Otherwise it is likely somebody will likely do something stupid like returning the unreviewed submittal marked "no exceptions taken" |
Wayne Yancey
Senior Member
Username: wayne_yancey
Post Number: 734
Registered: 01-2008
| | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 02:54 pm: | |
Thanks Mark for the warnings and red flags but enough with the questions.
I have answered by own request for the necessary wording. |
Wayne Yancey
Senior Member
Username: wayne_yancey
Post Number: 735
Registered: 01-2008
| | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 03:05 pm: | |
Mark,
After further review, I took your advise and repeated the potential scenario you described very clearly.
Thanks,
I owe you a donut or a beer when me next meet. |
Brett Scarfino (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 31, 2015 - 05:54 pm: | |
Wayne:
In a nutshell:
1) define the performance;
(a) no condensation at this and that temperature/relative humidity as determined using an approved software program (i.e. Therm by LBNL/NFRC);
(b) meet or exceed this U-factor.
2) the submittal would contain simulation results showing the interior glass/frame surface temperatures at the specified design criteria meet or exceed the specified dew point temperature (presuming this project is in a cold climate with winter condensation concerns). The submittal could also include the area weight calculation of U-factors (as well as the respective simulation results).
In my own humble opinion, project specific thermal modeling is far more assuring than generic CRFs. Most Architects will understand the results and implications after some coaching. |
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