Perimeter Foundation Drain Designer

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Author Message Trevor Senior Member Username: trevorpan Post Number: 13 Registered: 04-2014 Posted on Saturday, July 11, 2015 - 02:14 pm:    I've seen details showing a drain pipe to the side of the footing and on top of it at the base of a retaining wall/stem wall. Does anyone have a preference? Soils report recommends drainage for basement, retaining walls in this small residential project. Trevor Pan http://www.trevorpan.com Ronald L. Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP Senior Member Username: specman Post Number: 1326 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Saturday, July 11, 2015 - 02:44 pm:    Refer to IRC Section R405.1, if the project is regulated by the IRC (2012 edition); or, if the IBC (2012 edition) applies, see IBC Section 1805.4.2. Ron Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP www.specsandcodes.com Ronald L. Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP Senior Member Username: specman Post Number: 1327 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Saturday, July 11, 2015 - 02:48 pm:    I should point out that the previous code citations are for walls enclosing occupiable space. For retaining walls, you can use the same criteria, but there appears to be no criteria just for a retaining wall. The problem will be the requirements that are in relation to a floor, which does not exist in the case of a retaining wall, except for another pavement surface, maybe. Ron Geren, FCSI, AIA, CCS, CCCA, SCIP www.specsandcodes.com Richard Gonser AIA CSI CCCA SCIP Senior Member Username: rich_gonser Post Number: 108 Registered: 11-2008 Posted on Saturday, July 11, 2015 - 02:50 pm:    Very simple, place it 6 inches minimum below the finish floor elevation if it is part of a building. If it is a landscape wall it doesn't matter so much. If it's on top of the footing, the water can collect there and try to go under the wall to under the slab. Because where does the waterproofing stop? The key is to slope the top of the footing with slurry/grout with the waterproofing continuing across the top and down the footing side. Then the excess water dissipates more easily into the adjacent soil. Footings are usually 8-12 inches below the finish surface. So the subdrain can be placed adjacent to or on top of the footing. The difficulty comes with this one usual oversight by Civil and Plumbing. Where does the subdrain have it's outlet? Guidelines tend towards a 1% slope. But that is an impractical rule for most circumstances. Water will find it's own level, so a minimal slope with an outlet at full slope does the trick. Trevor Senior Member Username: trevorpan Post Number: 15 Registered: 04-2014 Posted on Sunday, July 12, 2015 - 01:24 pm:    Hi Ron, Thank you. I read IRC 405.1 the other day, it doesn't seem to prefer whether on top of the footing or to the side if a drain pipe and filter fabric are used. Perhaps a contractor option? Hi Richard, I plan to have a mortar cant with a wet applied waterproof membrane. It is an occupied space. Going down the side of the footing makes sense. There will be recompacted fill, so I imagine they'll form the sides as opposed to in a trench. The drain pipe will go to daylight. I also thought the last 10' section will transition to cast iron, so sunlight doesn't degrade the daylit portion. Thank you much - my first house! Trevor Pan http://www.trevorpan.com Richard Gonser AIA CSI CCCA SCIP Senior Member Username: rich_gonser Post Number: 109 Registered: 11-2008 Posted on Sunday, July 12, 2015 - 01:54 pm:    Make sure the outlet of the pipe goes to a spillway, rip rap(large gravel area), or drywell. This will allow it to dissipate before gouging the landscape. You can get more water flow through there, than you might think. John Regener, AIA, CCS, CCCA, CSI, SCIP Senior Member Username: john_regener Post Number: 747 Registered: 04-2002 Posted on Sunday, July 12, 2015 - 04:50 pm:    The subdrainage piping system is apparently "architectural" piping from my experience. It's always left for the architect to address. It also integrates with the hydrostatic relief/drainage products on the outside of the wall. But it's neither sitework or plumbing. So it must be architetural Complicating the matter, there is the below grade waterproofing which has protection installed on the outboard face. This can take the form of drainage gravel or a protection board product which integrates with the piping (my preference). Neither the Civil Engineer nor the Mechanical (plumbing engineer) will get involved. So, it's architectural. The solution is simple: Don't design buildings wih components within the sacred 5 foot line. Make the omniscient/omnipotent Construction Manager responsible for figuring out how foundation drainage gets included in the construction. J. Peter Jordan Senior Member Username: jpjordan Post Number: 853 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Monday, July 13, 2015 - 10:42 am:    I have taken the position that because the foundation drain systems need to connect to either sanitary or storm sewer systems, they should be addressed by the plumbing engineer. In some cases, the foundation drainage may have to be collected by a sump and pumped up to an elevation where it can connect to one of these systems. If the foundation drains are piped to a "dry well", then the Architect may be on the hook for such systems. Richard Gonser AIA CSI CCCA SCIP Senior Member Username: rich_gonser Post Number: 110 Registered: 11-2008 Posted on Monday, July 13, 2015 - 11:12 am:    Peter, I agree completely. The circumstance Trevor is mentioning appears to be a single residence with sloping site with no storm drain system. Once it gets beyond the 5 foot limit then Civil should pick it up. If it goes in the building, then it's plumbing that has to deal with it. I agree with John on using the drainage mats with the integrated drainage pipe. By far the best solution. Trevor, Call Roger Smith, the local WR Meadows rep. He can be very helpful.